Detective John: When you pay officers a good wage, you get quality applicants. We have PhDs that work here as officers. Officer Aaron: I cannot think of any place where you could have five full careers doing five totally different things and leave here just. I've tried all these different things. Detective John: I know I'm going to be in a wonderful part of the country. I know that I'm going to have a great union that fights hard for our benefits. There's no other law enforcement agency that I would want to work for. Narrator: Thank you for joining us for the Portland Police Bureau's Talking Beat. On today's special edition of the podcast, we're talking about recruiting and hiring of experienced police officers. PPB's recruitment Officer Patrick Johnson sits down with two of these lateral police bureau members, Officer Aaron and Detective John to discuss their perspectives of the bureau after working for other agencies. In this episode, they will discuss their firsthand experiences going through the hiring process as well as their views on training, pay, benefits, culture, time off, and what they enjoy most about living in the Portland metro area. Now let's jump into the episode. Officer Patrick: Hi. Welcome to our podcast today. I'm Officer Patrick Johnson, one of the recruiters at the Portland Police Bureau. Over the last year, we've hired about just over 85 officers and we continue to hire. Today we're going to talk a little bit about one of the types of officers we're hiring. We're hiring new hires right now that have no experience as an officer. We're also hiring laterals. Today I'm joined by Officer Aaron and Detective John. Thank you. Detective John: Thank you for having us. Officer Aaron: Likewise. Officer Patrick...: So let's just start with you, Aaron, 'cause you're right here with me. Where did you come from? Officer Aaron: I came from Largo UC on the West Coast of Florida. Officer Patrick...: Okay. How long were you there? Officer Aaron: About six-and-a-half years. Officer Patrick...: Six-and-a-half years Okay. How about you John? Detective John: I was a deputy in Louisiana, and I came up here to go to college. After leaving that department, I was a reserve with Washington County for a bit, and then I got hired with the police bureau. Officer Patrick: Okay, and what made you come back up to Portland? You said, "Up to Portland," so... Detective John: I had spent some time here in high school. My dad got relocated up here, and I finished high school and then I moved back home. So I lived there and after leaving here, you remember how nice it was. I love the outdoors. It's a wonderful place to live. The temperature here is much better than it is down South, so that's why I came back, just quality of life, I think. Officer Patrick: Just quality of life, things to do outside and everything else like that. Detective John: Yes. Officer Patrick: Okay. Aaron? Officer Aaron: Yes. Officer Patrick: What drove you up here? Officer Aaron: I came up and visited Portland and Seattle back in 2013-ish and just fell in love with just the Pacific Northwest, the climate, the city, just the way of life, I guess. Took a few more years and then in 2016, I applied when there was an open hiring and just saw an opportunity to move my family out here for just better pay, better benefits, just a better place for us to raise a family. Officer Patrick: Okay. So you said you came up here to visit. Were you doing your vacation and visiting anybody up here in particular or you just picked a place on the map and went there? Officer Aaron: No, it was just we liked Portland and we hadn't been up here. We'd never been to the Pacific Northwest. We hadn't had our kids yet, so it was just something kind new for us to try and we really absolutely just fell in love. We came here in the middle of winter, but still just absolutely fell in love with Portland and just that whole, just the Pacific Northwest was just beautiful. Officer Patrick: Okay. You guys have both talked about that a little. Let's talk a little more about that. What do you guys like about Portland? So you're working 40 hours a week as a police officer, majority of your time is not here as a police officer. What do you like doing off duty or what do you like about the Portland area or Oregon? Officer Aaron: In the city there's tons of stuff, tons of restaurants, place to go. From May to November, May to October the weather's really beautiful, so being outside is easy for us. We have a big yard so we can garden all year. There's a nice break from the rain during the summertime, and then you get that nice fall weather and just going to the beach, going to the mountains. Went camping last weekend in Tillamook Forest. It was a lot of fun. If there's something outdoors, you're close to the beach, close to the mountains, traveling's easy. Officer Patrick: So you talk about that, the Tillamook Forest, so that's how far away is that roughly by car? Officer Aaron: I think it was about 80 miles. Officer Patrick: When you were in Florida, 'cause that's something you could do, you could go do all that stuff in a day and go camping that close. Officer Aaron: Not really, we were on the West Coast and going to the beach was a 30-minute ride, nothing too bad. That was it, there was just the beach. You could go camping I guess somewhere in one of the forests, but not the variety of outdoor activities that you have out here. Officer Patrick: Okay. I know a lot of people here in Oregon to hike, they like to go camping. They like to ski, they do all stuff like that. John, where you were before, if you like to hike or camp, I don't know, is that something you were able to do really close to where you worked before? Detective John: Louisiana, one thing that I love about being here is you can just go into the woods and go hiking. There is lots of poisonous snakes and spiders- Officer Patrick: No thanks. Detective John: ... and yeah, there's alligators. I think down South is really pretty going on a boat ride through the swamp, but just being able to just be out there for a long time and enjoy it, I love to camp. When I would camp down there, I'd drive to North Carolina, which took me a whole day to get over there. Officer Patrick: Oh, wow. Detective John: So here, I can drive 45 minutes and there's amazing national forest to go camping in. The things that you can do here is, like you said, down South there's the beach of the Gulf of Mexico, but that's it. Here you know you can go to the beach if you want. You can go hiking, you can go do all kinds of really awesome things and you're usually looking at maybe an hour or a two-hour drive for awesome stuff. Officer Patrick: Okay. So on top of the outdoors, the climate you guys have talked about, one of you mentioned pay. I'm going to compare a little bit to your other agency. I'm not going to say what your other agencies are, 'cause we're not going to do that. But can you explain a little bit the differences of your other agency maybe in pay health benefits, something like that compared to what we have here in offering in Portland? Officer Aaron: So for me, the pay was a major part of it. I guess the best way to compare it would be previously where I worked, I would have to work off-duty or extra duty jobs to supplement my income. Here in the six-and-a-half years I've been here, I've never had to work an extra-duty job. They're available, but I've never had to, which has been nice. The healthcare benefits are really, really impressive. Had two of my kids here and that's been $0 out of pocket, which is really... Our health benefits are phenomenal. Officer Patrick: One of the things about having a child here in the City of Portland, what's one of the benefits that you get? Officer Aaron: Oh, well, like I said, I've had two of my children here and the City offers you six weeks of paid time off where the City covers your time. It's not taken out of your vacation bank or anything like that. So with the middle child that I've had, I was able to take six weeks off right out of the Advanced Academy, which was great. Then with my youngest, I took six weeks of the time that the City gave me and then we accrue a lot of vacation and various other times. So I was able to take actually three months total off with my youngest child. It's been really great to just be able to see her from growing up and even during COVID times, it was being able to be home with her. Officer Patrick: So you work to live, not live to work here? Officer Aaron: Yeah. Yeah. Officer Patrick: Okay. John, how about you comparing pay and benefits to your other agency? Detective John: All good. Officer Patrick: How about this? Maybe professionalism too, that the police bureau has compared to other agencies? Detective John: The pay here is much better. The benefits, we used to have to pay for part of our insurance. I was making $25,000 a year there if I didn't work overtime. So if I wanted to make money and do things, I had to work extra hard to get that. The professionalism, I think that it seems like when officers talk about their education here now, it seems like everybody, me, has a master's degree. The people here are extremely smart. They're a lot smarter than I am sometimes I think, but it is super professional. It's almost like a completely different job. I remember working down there, and I remember looking at the pay scale up in Portland, 'cause my parents still lived up here. I remember thinking they pay so much they'd never hire a cop from the South like me. The reality is is that they needed officers, and I probably should have applied all the way back then. So it's almost like a different job, the people here are completely different, a whole different world. I love it here. When I left there, I was actually not even sure that I wanted to remain in law enforcement. There's people there that I loved a lot, and it wasn't a bad experience to be there, but it is... after having come up here, I actually, I didn't even apply for this job initially. I was working for Department of Community Justice, and one of my co-workers when Portland came for their two week where they do a rotation to see what the other agencies, government agencies and law enforcement criminal justice do here. She was like, "You'd be a good Portland cop." I said, "I did that and I'm not really interested in it anymore. The department that I worked for down South was pretty closed-minded and it definitely didn't... that wasn't okay with me." So yeah, one of my coworkers, she got my email address and said, "I signed you up for the test," and I just showed up. I just assumed that all law enforcement was going to be the same way. Officer Patrick: Not as progressive as the Portland Police Bureaus? Detective John: Yeah, absolutely not. I came in for the interview, and the other places that I applied from being full-time law enforcement and then doing reserves, I went into that interview, those interviews ready to say what I think they wanted to hear. I came into the interview here, and I was just completely open and honest about the way I felt about everything. I remember leaving that like, "I don't think they're going to pick me," right? Officer Patrick: Mm-hmm. Detective John: And they did. My old employer that I worked for here in Portland, the Department of Community Justice, they were nice enough to say, "Hey, look, your job is here if you want it." So when I got off my probation here, I was waiting for one time to see any unprofessional stuff happened. There was gratuity problems down there. There was officers constantly getting in trouble or deputies constantly getting in trouble for doing things. A lot of them were doing things to survive. One of the guys I worked with robbed a bank down there. Officer Patrick: I guess 'cause the wages were so low. Detective John: It was so low that people had to come up with other ways to survive. Everybody there worked at Walmart when they were off, and you were lucky to get those Walmart jobs, right? Officer Patrick: Mm-hmm. Detective John: You would get that, and they would keep you. You don't really see the contrast when you pay officers a good wage, you get quality applicants we have PhDs that work here as officers. We have people that went to Ivy League schools, top of their class that came here. So I went my whole probation, and I remember thinking to myself, "If I see anything unprofessional, if I see people stealing stuff or anything, if I- Officer Patrick: Something you don't want to be a part of. Detective John: ... if people are saying racist comments, homophobic comments, "I'm out." I've never seen that here, and it changed my mind. I mean this 100%. Her signing me up for the test was one of the best things that's ever happened to me. I love working here. I make great money and I live in a great place. Officer Patrick: That's a great story. I'm going to ask a little bit about the application process. John, you were already here. So Aaron, I'm going to ask you a little more about this because you were in a different state. Officer Aaron: Yes. Officer Patrick: Can you just take me quickly through how it was through the process? You don't have to take me step-by-step, but just tell me how much you were able to do there and versus here, and I can fill in where things have changed now for our process. Officer Aaron: So at the time I applied in January. I think the hiring opened up January 2016, right around the first or second. The one thing that I was able to do was we were able to get the personal history questionnaire, all your background stuff. So I already had that completed, so I was able to just submit that on the first or the second. Officer Patrick: Okay. Officer Aaron: After that, I was contacted by a background investigator and they basically just gave me a quick timeline. I think I came in March for an oral board and meeting with the personnel sergeant and my background investigator go over my personal history questionnaire. I think at that time that's when I think I filled out the paperwork for the background for the psych, but I didn't take the psych yet. I was alluded to that I would be starting some time in the summer of 2016 and that time came and passed and it was, I guess, people were being pushed back to the street 'cause of low numbers. So I didn't get called until August to come back out for my psych and my medical. So I had to fly back out here for psych and medical, and it was hard. I wasn't making a lot of money. I was basically living on credit cards at the time, just trying to make ends meet. So flew back out here, did my psych and medical, found out I passed, and then background was really good. They gave me an idea of what would be a good start date for me. So I was also in the process of trying to sell a house, so I had to wait. I didn't want to put my house up for sale before I got hired. So basically, as soon as I found out that I passed the psych and was given my offer of employment, I basically, we put the house on the market immediately before I flew back, lucky enough, that the house sold very quickly. The start time was actually really flexible. They basically gave me whenever the pay periods were, like, "Hey, you can start at any of these pay periods?" So we packed up, we sold everything, whatever we couldn't fit into a 12x6 U-Haul trailer, which we taped out in our house- Officer Patrick: Perfect. Preparation. Officer Aaron: ... and hitched it to our car. Basically, I left Florida September 16th, and I started here September 21st. So drove across the country, got settled in our apartment on a Monday, and I started here on a Thursday. Officer Patrick: I'm glad to have you. Officer Aaron: Yeah. Officer Patrick: The process now is just a little bit different. So now it's about four to five months for new hires through the whole process. Laterals could be a little quicker just 'cause they've been through everything and you don't have to come out here until the end of the process for the psych and medical. The good thing is we do offer relocation assistance up to $10,000, and that's paid back after you're hired. So you could use some of that to come out for your psych and medical. Did you get any relocation assistance? Officer Aaron: Yeah. So I was actually really impressed. It felt like I was applying more for a private sector job where I was able to use my experience and my time already as a police officer to negotiate a pay scale that was more in line with my experience. They paid for $2,500 in moving expenses. There was a hiring bonus at the time, so I got a $10,000 hiring bonus, which was paid out. It was like a $6,000 bonus and then two $2,000 bonuses over the last... I got the last one a couple of years ago. Officer Patrick: Right now, we have a $5,000 hiring bonus. Officer Aaron: So the bureau, during my hiring, I was able to get, my vacation bank was given 100 hours right when I got off probation, a vacation. Then I accrue my sick time, vacation time as a ... even though I've only been here at Portland for six-and-a-half years, I accrue it at a 13-year officer rate. Officer Patrick: It takes all your experience. Officer Aaron: Yes, and again, I'm a top, top police officer here, so that's hugely beneficial. Officer Patrick: So John, because Aaron talked a little bit there, and we'll talk to you about this next and then come back to Aaron. How does the amount of training here at the Portland Police Bureau compare to where you were before? Aaron already alluded to the Advanced Academy, which is an extra 10 to 13, 12-ish weeks depending on how the scheduling is in addition to the Basic Academy through the state, which is 16. How do you compare the training here to your other agency? Detective John: You go to two academies here unless you're lateraling over. So if it's somebody that's new that's coming here, they have to go to Basic. That's actually a great time if you want to save some money too, you can live there if you decide to. Yeah, but the training, this might sound like a joke and things might've changed because I've been with the bureau now for almost 13 years, but you'd ride with a coach for two weeks. They gave you a gun, and then you were supposed to figure it out. Officer Patrick: Wow. Detective John: Then if they decided they were going to keep you there, then they sent you to the police academy. Like I said, I don't know how things are there now, but the training here has been, it's been awesome. It's very professional. It seems like it's driven by stuff that works and yeah, it's just super professional here. Also, the training that the bureau will send you to, down there, the idea of putting in for a bomb school or something was just not even something that you'd consider, right? Officer Patrick: Yep. Detective John: So here, you can find the training and go pitch that to your supervisors and say, "This is something that I'm interested in doing." So it's a completely different experience. Officer Patrick: What about you? You came in straight from Florida and went through a two-week course of material- Detective John: Yes. Officer Patrick: ... and then went to an Advanced Academy. How did that compare to your other agency in addition to how much training we get per year on top of what John said, stuff you want to put in for a bomb school? Officer Aaron: Yeah. I worked for a very large agency and the training program there was excellent. Actually, my first police academy I think was almost, it was straight through. I think it was maybe 40 weeks. It was extremely long. Officer Patrick: Was that a military base? Officer Aaron: Yeah. Officer Patrick: Okay. Officer Aaron: It was a paramilitary style of police academy. Officer Patrick: Okay. Officer Aaron: So the one thing I was super impressed with here was when I got hired, they were able to use... because I had my experience as law enforcement in Florida, I was able to meet the requirements that I did not have to go to the Basic Academy here in Oregon. However, I had to do what was called PICOT. I'm not sure if it's still called that, but basically it was to bridge that gap with legal and our circuit court and how laws are applied out here on the West Coast. So what they basically did was I had the option of going for two weeks down to DPSST or they would send me the material, and I would study on my own time with my coach, and I chose the second one. So I basically studied at the time, and then I had to go down to Salem to DPSST. I took a test on a computer, an equivalency test. I passed it, and then I just continued on my way. I went out to the road first. I did November, December with a coach out here in East Precinct. Then I went to the Advanced Academy for I think 10 or 11 weeks and then back out. But very seamless. The Advanced Academy is great. It's an adult learning environment. It's not paramilitary at all. You're treated like an adult, which was important to me. I get it, there's people from all different backgrounds, but like John said, there's people with PhDs and law degrees and people who have had whole other careers. They're not just hiring 23-year-olds, they're hiring 35-year-olds. So having that adult learning environment, and that adult learning experience where you're just treated like somebody who's has the ability to learn new ideas without being screamed at, was really great. Detective John: Yeah, you're treated like an adult. Officer Aaron: Yeah. I know that sounds bizarre, but you are treated like... It's not coming from a paramilitary learning background, which for me, I was 23 when I became a police officer. So at the time that it was perfectly fine for me. I'm not ex-military. That learning environment worked, and I very much enjoyed my career on the West Coast of Florida. Detective John: That was a big concern for me coming here is that I had already been to two police academies, the post in Louisiana and then the reserve, DPSST Reserve Academy over in Washington County. So I was older when I applied to Portland. I was in my 30s and again, part of that testing the job to see if I like it. I didn't want to be treated like a kid 'cause an adult with life experience, and there was none of that. The Advanced Academy here, it's actually fun. The police academy down there, every day I was like, "Am I going to fail?" It didn't make for a good learning environment for me 'cause I was more focused on the failing than actually understanding and learning. So the Advanced Academy here, for somebody that's from a different agency, it's actually fun. Officer Patrick: You like it. Detective John: You'll actually enjoy it. Again, going back to the training, like I said, you rode with a coach for two weeks down there. The probation here is 18 months and some of that you do by yourself. The process to learning I think is, it's much longer, but it also, it makes it so you actually, when you're out there by yourself, you are super comfortable if you're brand new. I was an FTO before I promoted, and the FTOs that I work with, they'll know that you're from another agency and there's no, "Our way's better." They're happy to have you here, and it's not a stressful situation. It's nothing like it was down there. It's actually, a lot of fun to be on probation and I was dreading it when I got hired here. Officer Patrick: You mentioned 18 months, so 18 months is a new hire. We don't come over as a lateral. You had gone back to school so it took a little longer, but technically, in my opinion, you've lateraled 'cause you came from another agency. So yours was a year? Officer Aaron: Mine was a year. Officer Patrick: Okay. Officer Aaron: It did get extended 'cause I took the six weeks of baby leave, so you get extended by about six weeks. But at least for me, going through FTO was enjoyable. I was lucky where our vCAD program is the same program I came from, so I was very familiar with the computer program. It was enjoyable. I rotated through north and east afternoons and days, and I was treated like an adult. I was treated like a lateral, which made me feel good. I understood that there was still a learning experience, but I'd only left my agency... I resigned on the 16th and I started here on the 21st, not a huge gap in missed training. It was great. I really felt my sergeants were great. If there was an issue on a call, I never felt like I was being hung out to dry. Detective John: I would say that the other agency I worked for, a big part of probation there was like they wanted to know if you were a good fit to work with whatever crew you were at, and they'd weeded you out if they didn't think you were a good fit. I know there's even some departments like that here in Oregon. From being an FTO and having gone through it, I just don't... there's none of that here. It isn't like, "You're going to have to prove that you're one of us and you go along with our culture." Everybody here is just completely different. That's another thing that I love about it is people here, everybody comes from a different background, and I think it's great. Officer Patrick: Another thing that I want to hit on that we talked a little bit about where we're talking about camping and stuff like that, but home life. I'm not going to go too deep into it, but home life as in the fact of here, we work 40 hours a week, four 10-hour shifts, three days off in a row, it doesn't rotate. Can you explain a little bit how your home life was based on the hours you worked before, if there was any home life, or if you had any time to do anything based on the shifts you work? 'Cause I know every agency has different types of shifts, but I know majority of the officers here, the four 10s with the not rotating days off. You don't have to pull a calendar out to see if you have Saturday off four months down the road. Detective John: Yeah. In Louisiana, I worked 12-hour shifts. I'd work three days and then I'd be off two days. Then the schedule, also it rotated, so you would work two weeks of days and then two weeks of nights so it was fair for everybody. So that was very difficult getting my sleep together. I don't sleep great to begin with. Everything has to be perfect for me and just having a schedule. Also, we work 40 hours a week. You can work overtime if you want, but we also get wellness time. So I get to work out four times a week, and it's not on my own time, so that's an extra four hours that I have at home. Officer Patrick: So that is one hour of your 10-hour shift- Detective John: Yes. Officer Patrick: ... you get a workout paid for by the City? Detective John: Yeah, it's unbelievable. I do it at the end of my day, and it helps me clear my mind from whatever calls that I had during the day. I get to go home and it's my decompression time. Like I said, it's another four hours a week that, and my workout schedules have been much more consistent too. A lot of times it's hard for people to make time and the bureau is like, "This is your hour. If you want to keep working, keep working. If you don't want to do wellness, otherwise, you can go to the gym." It's fantastic. Officer Patrick: Fantastic and it's a whole mind and body thing, so it's hopefully help making you a better person overall. Aaron, what about you for the shifts you work with trying to get some type of home life versus what you have now? Officer Aaron: Oh, the three days off in a row consistent is great. I work 12s as well. With the three days off, two days on, there was no change in hours, but the 6:00 AM to 6:00 PM or 6:00 PM to 6:00 AM was brutal. Coming here, I love the four 10s. When I was off probation, I requested night shifts 'cause it was 10:00 PM to 8:00 AM, which at the time worked really well for my life. The good thing about night shift here was I was able to get Saturday, Sunday, Monday off within about a year. Officer Patrick: Wow. Officer Aaron: So I had weekends off, so I've been here six-and-a-half years. It'll be seven years in September. Except for about maybe 12, 14 months when I first got cut loose, I've had weekends off. Officer Patrick: That's the thing now someone gets hired today, we are hiring so much that you can quickly gain seniority fast like that. Officer Aaron: Yeah. It was more important for me to have the weekends off and work nights than to be on a different schedule. That was my schedule until I went to detectives. Officer Patrick: The 12s that you have was one of those where you have to pull out a calendar and see what days off you're off? Officer Aaron: Totally. Totally. Officer Patrick: August, whatever am I off? Officer Aaron: Yeah, and we bid every year, so you could have something planned out, but you could get bumped to the different shift, and then all your days off would switch. Everything would be backwards. We still do bids here occasionally, but one, I like that there's a 45 day... if you're going to get bumped by somebody with more seniority, at least you have 45 days. You have knowledge. You have time to plan. I've never been bumped. Like I said, I went to night shift, had weekends off and never got bumped off my weekends and that's been really nice. I know if you move around a little bit more, but if you want to move different precincts, it's all pretty easy here. You're just put in a transfer request and 45 days later, as long as it's approved, you're where you want to be. Detective John: Yeah, I got hired and they were actually full. There's so many opportunities here to do different things, and so you may be low on seniority, but you can work your way into a neighborhood response team. There's opportunities out there for officers where they can also get good time off. So it's not all based off of how long you're here, right? Officer Patrick: Yeah. Detective John: You can work really hard and achieve. When I came here, because at Louisiana we had to rotate, so it was fair for everybody, when I came here, I wasn't too sure about the seniority thing. But the thing is, is that I am a pretty loyal person to my job, and so if you're here for a little bit, you have that and like you said, you can count on it. You don't have to worry about getting bumped off or something. Talking about the vacation here, I wasn't too worried at my agency about taking vacation, and that's not a good thing. It's because we only got two weeks a year. Officer Patrick: Oh, wow. Wow. Detective John: The vacation here is, it's ridiculous. Officer Patrick: Every year you gain more time. Detective John: Yeah, it's fantastic. Honestly, I like to travel, and when I'm traveling to other countries, they're always like, "You Americans don't get a whole lot of vacation. You're always working." When I tell them how much vacation I get there, they're like, "Oh, my gosh, like our vacation." So yeah, it's... Officer Aaron: Yeah, I think my last year on nights was the same year that my last kid was born and I took off all the time at the beginning of the year when she was born. Then I think starting in August, I went down to... because they basically open up the vacation book, you pick any days that are available. So I went down to a three-day work week, and I just took off every Tuesday at the beginning of my week for two months, and I still have tons of... John's over usually. Detective John: Oh, yeah. I'm three weeks over right now. Officer Aaron: John has to take three weeks of vacation. Detective John: I have two years of holidays banked on top of that. I'm three weeks over how much I can roll over next year. Officer Patrick: So how that accumulation works is the beginning of each year we get 40 hours of personal time anytime you want to take off. So that's four days off. Officer Aaron: And the dependent care is really nice. Officer Patrick: Yes. You get sick time with the dependent care. You also have 10 holidays, and if you work those holidays, then you get 15 hours. If it's your regular day off, you get 10 hours. Everything starts adding up there. If you just want to take the day off, it's your workday, it's just a net. But then you start off at 112 hours of vacation, it just goes up four point plus hours each year on top of that and just keeps adding up. So you do gain a lot pretty fast. Detective John: I can literally take months off, which is just, it's crazy. Officer Patrick: It's a good feeling to have. Detective John: It's nice, I like having that there. So if some opportunity comes where I can go somewhere for a long time, I can jump on that. It's fantastic, the vacation time. Officer Aaron: Yeah, I already took off the first week of June I'll be gone, here for two weeks and I'm gone for another two weeks. As long as there's availability, there's plenty of time to take. Detective John: Yeah, a guy that's in our office, he's getting ready to go on his third trip abroad this year. Officer Patrick: Wow. Wow. Detective John: Yeah, it's great. Officer Patrick: With a good pay wage and a lot of time off, you can go have some fun. I was talking to you guys a little earlier and the one thing that made you guys really happy and John smiled a lot over there was talking about the opportunities at the Portland Police Bureau. Can you start, John, talking about the opportunities, opportunities you've had and what's available at an agency like this size compared to other agencies? Detective John: Yeah, I think the coolest thing to me is with hard work, I feel like you could achieve anything you wanted here. Even if there's a position that they don't have, you could make the case for that position. I think all of us have gotten really good opportunities. When I came, I went to night shift, and there was no partner cars at the time. I wrote a letter to my supervisor saying, "This is why I think my district was one of the busier ones in the whole city." They said, "You know what? You guys both work hard. You can have that partner car." I had that. Then they started a foot patrol unit a little bit after that, and I was able to work myself to great days off with three years on. I get the weekend off, I'm working noon to 10:00 at night, which was a great schedule 'cause I can sleep in. Then from that, I was a school resource officer. Then I went and started working in child abuse, which is a position that Aaron has right now is my old position. It didn't exist. So we were expanding the unit that we were in, and I had some ideas, and they actually created that position because they thought that we needed to be going out. It was doing knock-and-talks on cyber tips that we got. And so I've left and they've kept that position. So I've talked to a bunch of other officers, which he has my old job, but he's a million times better than I was at it, a million times. It's not even close. But yeah, we have officers here that have come up with all kinds of ideas, and they'll write an operation plan and it gets approved and they get to do it. The other agencies that I with, it was like, really like, "You are going to follow the rules here, and this is the way that it's been because it's always been that way," and it was their way or the highway. Here it's just like with hard work, that's what I talk to people about that all the time, if you want to work your way somewhere here, you put in the work and you are definitely going to get there. You don't have to worry about politics. The department that I worked for, it was all what you'd done for the sheriff's campaign and who you knew, if your family member worked there. I knew nobody here, and great things have happened to me. Officer Aaron: Yeah, I think I'm in a unique position. So I've been from a FTO here, I'm an ECIT, I think John, you're one of the earlier ECITs, and going to those trainings was super easy. I put in for it and I got it. One of the more unique opportunities I had was there was a rash of arsons in East Portland where I was working and I realized even though we do have arson investigators that I knew nothing about it. So I put in for a training class down at DPSST, and I got approved for it. So I was one of the only cops in this fire training class to learn more about arson. But even beyond that, so I'm an officer, but I'm assigned to detectives, and John is actually my partner. When I was applying for this job, I actually spoke to John who I didn't know at the time and was inquiring about it 'cause I'd put in for this position. So John and I are assigned to the ICAC or Internet Crimes Against Children Unit. John, like I said, held that position before and did such a great job at it that they made it permanent, and when he was promoted they were looking for a replacement. So I called John to get an idea about it. I interviewed and was able to get the spot, and then when John was able to come back, he actually was able to come back to ICAC and now we're partners. So it's just been a great opportunity. You can have a partner if you want. If you don't want one, you don't want one. But John and I have found a really good working relationship and our supervisors are great. They listen to our ideas, they're really supportive. So the unit originally had one detective working these crimes half their time and now there's five full-time people there and a full-time analyst. I think that feeling like your supervisors and your command listen and respond to the amount of work that's being created, it feels good. You don't feel like you're being left out. We're able to show that there's much more work to do and they respond by making sure we have the resources to accomplish our goals. They support any training that John and I want to go do. If we want to try out software, they're supportive of that. If we need meetings, they help arrange those. So anytime we have an issue, we feel heard. Detective John: Yeah, I think the word that sums everything up is just supportive. The supervisors here are like, "What can we do to make you better?" So again, you put in the work, and you're going to be supported here 100%. Yeah, it's a great environment to work in. Officer Patrick: Another thing when I was talking to you guys that made you both light up, and we won't mention restaurants, is the food scene in Portland. What do you think about that? Detective John: Coming from New Orleans, Southern food's pretty awesome. So when I came to Portland, I really wasn't expecting to be blown away by the food. Louisiana has great southern food, there's great Vietnamese food there too. But outside of that, it's not a super diverse place. The thing that's great about Portland is that whatever type of food that you're into is here. There's high-end, James Beard-nominated chefs that run those restaurants and there's food out there that you've never tried before, and you're going to get a legit version of that food. Like I said, I like to travel. You can go get authentic Chinese food here that when I went to China, it was the same thing. So it's just a diversity of food here and the quality is fantastic. Then if you like seafood, I know people down South are going to hate me saying this, the oysters up here are way better than the oysters in the Gulf of Mexico if you asked me. Dungeness crab is way better than blue crab. So yeah, the food here is fantastic. Yeah, we're excited at lunch every time [inaudible 00:40:06] Officer Patrick: As partners, you guys get to go together, right? Officer Aaron: Yeah. Yeah. The food scene here, it's very impressive. We go out quite a bit. We go to a Thai place at 28th and Burnside that's just absolutely phenomenal. But yeah, anything you want. I cannot think of anything you can't get something really well somewhere here in the city. I think that what makes Portland unique is the neighborhood layout. So instead of having just the City Center, there's Woodstock, Alberta, Sellwood and all these neighborhoods have all their own unique restaurants. There's little tiny areas that if you go to a 28th and Gladstone, there's a ton of restaurants over there and it's hidden away. But anywhere you go, you're going to get good food, good drinks. Like I said, the weather's perfect right now, so sitting outside, 'cause it's a great place to live. Officer Patrick: Okay, one last thing for you guys. If there is an officer that's either a new hire or a lateral, like you guys that is thinking about making a switch, why Portland? Officer Aaron: So for me, I would say the opportunity. We're the largest agency in Oregon, you get the ability to try anything. So I'm on our crisis negotiation team, so the team's number one in the country. So I get to work with SERT, get to work with the bomb guys. I get to go out on pretty exciting things all the time. If that's what you want, this city and this agency has that ability to make that happen for you and the support that comes with that, so you're not just given a position and then no support. You're given that position and then all the training that comes along with it. Again, I'm this unique opportunity where I'm an officer in a detective spot, so I get to do... I'm still an officer, but I get to be in detectives, I get to experience detectives. If I want to try something else, I have that ability to go try something else. I think that ability just to try new things, there's always positions opening and opportunities and shifts. I cannot think of any place where you could have five full careers doing five totally different things and leave here just, "Oh, I've tried all these different things." Officer Patrick: That's a good way to put it. Detective John: Yeah. Even creating new positions for you if you work hard, I would say somebody coming from another agency, down there in Louisiana, I didn't think I had a shot getting hired. I just looked at the pay scale in Portland and I was like, "They're not going to hire some dumb, young cop like me." The thing that's great about it here is that, like I said, it's fair. You don't have to worry about politics. Just all you have to do is just work hard, and you'll get great things in your career. Yeah, the opportunity here is great. When I had left Louisiana, I wanted to work federal law enforcement for the Forest Service. That's why I started going to school. At the time, I was thinking about different federal agencies. I thought about the U.S. Marshals, and I thought, "I'm too dumb to do any of those things." Then like I said, thank God somebody else signed me up for the test and I've had a fantastic career here. I've been in, like you said, a bunch of different units. It's not like you're going to work patrol forever. You get to basically get different jobs doing completely different things and your pay and your vacation time, your job security, it all stays the same. So for people from other agencies, if you don't think that Portland would hire you, if you're a good person and a hard worker, they definitely want you here. Yeah, going back to the federal thing, it's like we're both in the process of being task force officers with HSI. Our unit, we have three detectives that are TFOs with the FBI, and then the two of us are going to be with HSI. So we're working for those agencies too. Officer Patrick: What's HSI? Detective John: Homeland Security Investigations. So they're driving FBI cars at our office. They have offices over at the FBI, all that stuff. I never thought that anything like that would happen to me here, and I honestly would much rather work here than work for the feds. I don't have to worry about being moved. I know I'm going to be in a wonderful part of the country. I know that I'm going to have a great union that fights hard for our benefits. I mean this, there's no other law enforcement agency that I would want to work for. Officer Patrick: That's good to hear. Aaron, John, thank you for joining us today. Appreciate it. We're hiring, continuing to hire. If you want to learn more about it, go to joinportlandpolice.com. Our wages starting off entry level over $79,000, and they go top step of 113 plus on top of you get longevity, and there's a bunch of pay incentives on top of all that. So thank you very much guys. Detective John: Yeah. Officer Aaron: You're welcome. Detective John: Thanks for joining us. Narrator: Thanks again for listening to this special edition of the Portland Police Bureau's Talking Beat. A reminder, the Portland Police Bureau is currently hiring new and lateral officer positions. To learn more, contact a recruiter or if you're ready to apply, please visit www.joinportlandpolice.com.