Okay, hopefully y'all can hear me now. Um, we are still on day one of the witnesses that were testifying in the pre-trial for the Naziah Harris case. Jarvis Buts is the one that is actually on trial. And um we're going to start and see how far I can make it. My energy is lower than I thought it would be. I feel like a nap right now, but we're going to get started. Um I am here to just offer my own reaction and commentary to this courtroom footage. So, all right, let's just get started. You see more than I do. >> I got six more. >> My numbers look nice. I appreciate it. They matter. I'm all about the number. I'm kind of just letting this part play because part of the getting that trial and courtroom feeling is looking at the person, you know, that's on trial. So, I'm not skipping yet. Um, and they should be getting started soon anyway. So, I'm just going to do my greetings. And they got it zoomed in on him. So, I'mma let it stay there for a minute. >> Okay, let me I'm so sorry. Let me orient cuz that's a good Darlene says he's still wearing the mask. This is the pre-trial that happened back in January well January of this year. So I don't know if he's sick or whatever, but he was wearing this back in January 6, 2025, and that's when this is this is still day one of the pre-trial. We watched the grandmother and the aunt that was the mother of his five kids. We watched them yesterday and today we're watching a few different people, but notably I'm trying to make it to the his sister 82796 >> and good afternoon. Good afternoon services by Ken Rig 82125 on behalf of Mr. Charles. Good afternoon. Neighborhood defender service 83973. Also on behalf of legal council and Mr. State your name can have a seat. >> All right. Who will be doing the next witness? >> Judge. That'll be me. And at this time people would call police officer Derek Wolf. No, he's not Mr. M and Mr. Roman from defense council. Can I have your approach? >> Um, you can have a seat. I hate that it's showing as if it's jumpy cuz I'm looking at it playback on my phone and I don't know what that is and I hate that. Y'all just bear with it. Hopefully it gets better. But everything is good. I have great internet. I have my connection's fine. I don't know. I feel like it's the platform. I'm so tired of these streaming platforms. Okay. So, the brief sidebar I had with Mr. Make and Mr. Regarding Officer Wolf, I just want to put on the record that officer Wolf is an appointed 36th District Court. I do not have a personal relationship with him. Uh only a working relationship in which he comes to the courtroom in 234 to do his job as a court officer. I um want to make sure with the people in defense there's no objection to me hearing his testimony today. >> I'm going to disconnect and try real fast. I It's unpredictable and it's so frustrating. Hold on one second. Let me reconnect my screen. We'll try. If not, oh, I hate this. I'm so sorry, y'all. Did I share my sound? >> Okay, I'll swear you in. >> You swear to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth. >> Yes. Okay, you can begin. >> Can you state your name for the record, sir? >> Derek Wolf. >> And what do you do for a living currently? >> I work at work at 33 district court at the court officer. >> And how long have you worked at 36 District Court? >> Uh, two months. >> And prior to that, uh, where do you work at? >> Detroit public schools department. >> And how long did you in total work for the Detroit public schools? >> 17 and a half years. [clears throat] Um, you worked for DPS for 17 and a half years. >> Yes. >> And how long have you been in law enforcement in total? >> Uh, 39 years. >> Before DPS, who did you work for? >> I retired from Detroit Police Department. >> And what were some of your uh common roles and responsibilities at the Detroit Public Schools Police Department? >> Uh, we go to the school. Uh sometime we talk to the kids, we take care of the building, take care of the principal, we take care of the family and make sure everybody's uh [clears throat] by by the law. >> And in January of 2024, what was your assignment at the DPS Police Department? >> I was assigned to investigations. And as part of that assignment, does that include going out and taking reports from people who are making police reports to the school police department? >> Yes. >> I want to direct your attention to January 10th, 2024. Did you go to J Clark School in Detroit? >> Yes. >> And what was the reason you went there, sir? >> I got a um sent there by my lieutenant about a missing 13-year-old young lady from the school. And when you went there, did you speak with someone who was making that report? >> Uh, yes. >> Who was that person? >> I talked to her guardian, her grandmother, which is her guardian. >> And is that Annette Harris? >> Yes. >> And in terms of taking that report, um, what's that process like? I don't want to go into what anybody said to you, but what information are you looking for to gather to put into your report? >> Okay. I'm making a miss report. So, I asked um Miss Harris uh when the last time seen our daughter. Um I mean, excuse me, her uh granddaughter. Um description of what she had on. Um has she ever been missing before? Um I camped the area, found anything. So, I found out the bus number that she was on. I got the the video and it showed where she got off the bus at Cornwell and Three Mile. >> Said Cornwell and Three Mile. >> Cornwell Three Mile. Okay. >> And uh from that point, like I said, uh we went to the house, talked to the grand uh guardian again, talked to some of the people in the house and then we uh went on in and let it go from there. >> Sorry, just to be clear, you keep on saying we are you work are you doing these things with a partner? >> Yes. And who is that partner? >> Uh DL Garner. >> Okay. Judge, may I approach? >> Yes. >> Approaching what has already been admitted as exhibit people's exhibit two. >> Do you recognize that, sir? >> Yes. >> And what is that that is contained in exhibit 2? >> Uh school bus. >> And is that a still shot from the video that you pulled or that you received? >> Yes. >> Okay. And that's the bus that you identified that Nazisiah Harris was on. >> Yes. One moment. >> Sure. >> I have no idea. Thanks, bro. Good afternoon. >> Thank you. >> Mr. Wolf, you were dispatched to the J. Clark school because you're an investigator for GPS. >> I was not dispatched. The lieutenant came to the office and told us to go by the school for the missing. >> Okay. So, you were requested, your presence was requested at the school. >> Yeah. From my lieutenant. >> You don't have an office within the school? >> No. >> So, you're not like the school resource officer, per se? >> No. >> Okay. Um, and you said you met with Miss Annette Harris on the 10th. >> Okay. So, I didn't want to interrupt. Uh, but I definitely had made a mental note, Miss Queen Liz, that he said when they asked him the question, they said, "Is that the bus that Naziah got on?" That's what they asked. So, now I'm wondering, did she get on the bus and then she got off somewhere else? And so, she at least did the bus part. She That's what I was wondering. So, I was like, I thought she didn't even make it on the bus. So, we heard the same thing. I'm wondering if that's how he asked the question or if she actually was able to get on the bus, but we heard the same thing. >> Yes. >> And that's a January appointment. >> January. Yes. >> Um that was early in the morning >> around uh between 11 and 12. >> So, school was in session at that time. >> Yes. >> Did you speak with um the teacher who was in um Msiah's classroom on the 9th of January? >> No. Did you speak with any of Messiah's known friends >> in the investigation? Yes, >> you did. Um, who did you speak to? >> I can't recall that. >> Did they Did you write them in a report? >> No, not a missing report. >> Okay. So, you spoke with folks, but you didn't record their names. >> I recorded them probably on my right sheet, but not inside the missing report. >> Okay. Is that normal that you don't record names on the actual missing report? this cuz she did she did clarify that question. Okay. Um All right. We'll keep going >> and you didn't take statements from anybody. >> Uh not no time >> ever. >> No. >> Okay. Did you speak with anybody else at the school [snorts] uh about Nessiah either on the 10th or anytime after that? >> Only on the 10th. I talked to the guardian which is the grandmother and a couple of students. >> A couple Yes. >> Okay. Do you know how many? >> A couple. Two. >> Two. Okay. Just wanted to make sure we're we have the same definition of a couple. >> And you said you canvased the area? >> Yes. >> What area did you canvas? >> Uh the three mile area. We all around there uh checking alleys, knocking on doors, seeing if we can get some uh video door camera footage like that. Three mile. Is that three mile drive? >> Three mile in Cornwell, that area. >> Okay. And that's where the bus stop was. >> Yes. >> Where um where Josiah would have gotten off the bus? >> Yes. >> Um anywhere else around the school? >> Uh we checked around the schools. We checked on matter of fact on her street as well. >> Five. We didn't find anything. >> Um in her classroom, does she have a locker or a cubby or anything where she stores items? I can answer that question. >> You don't know? >> I don't know. >> Fair to say then that you didn't check. >> I may have, but I can't call right now a long time. >> Is there a report that documents whether you did or not? >> Uh, no. >> I was just about to say, "Ma'am, let him look back at his report and he can see cuz it's been a long time." But then she asked, "Is that something you would put on your report?" He says, "No." Now, I don't a cubby hole might not be something that a police officer cares about putting on their report, but when he didn't record the names of who he spoke to, that my eyebrows raised, you know. >> Okay. And after you um did the canvas of the area of Three Mile Drive in Cornwall, what else did you do? I went back to the station and by the lieutenant of what we came up with. >> She actually looks younger than 13 to me, Mary. She I have her picture on the um thumbnail, but yeah, she looked younger than 13 to me, >> which was what? >> Which was I talked [snorts] to the parent, the grandparent, um talked to other students. Um we didn't find anything from doing our search of the area. So, did you do anything else uh in regards to investigating? >> Uh, no, I did not because I was uh getting ready to retire, so I was done. >> Okay. >> Oh my effing god. He actually said I I hope it's one of those times where you're thinking internally and you thought you said it out loud because I hope he means the case was reassigned so he didn't do more. Not I was about to retire so I was done. So I was checked out done because please tell me that's not what he meant. But that's how it sounds when he the way he said it. It sounds like I was about to retire. So I I did a couple of people. No, I didn't take down the names. Why would y'all send him outside to go look for a missing person and he about to retire? But also maybe most people, most cops when they're about to retire don't act like this. So you still expect them to perform their job. But the way he made that sound, that is disappointing. >> I don't have anything further. >> Any redirect? >> Very briefly. >> Um, how long you were first notified about this on the 10th? Correct. >> Yes. >> And how long did you stay involved in the investigation? >> That day. >> Okay. So, your activities that Miss Quake asked you about contained all happened on the 10th of January? Yes. >> What happened to the investigation after the 10? >> Uh if someone someone else's investigation would have took over uh besides me because once again I was leaving. >> Um but I gave all the information that I had along well with my run sheet as well. So >> Oh, this me did check out this and me did check out. Did you just see his body? Oh, y'all can't see it cuz it's not streaming right. He shrugged his He shrugged his shoulders and gave like a oh well face when he was like, "Yeah, pass it on to somebody else." And then he did like a you know like that shrug shoulders. You you purse your lips type thing. I'm so sorry if y'all can't see it. I don't know what's going on my streaming platform. But he has a very his body language is saying no. I checked out. It wasn't cuz I officially, you know, just >> did what I was supposed to do then pass it on to someone else. He doesn't >> Oh my gosh, this is despicable. >> Again, I was leaving. Um but I gave all information that I had along while with my run sheet as well. >> So >> it was passed off to another investigator. >> Yeah, it would be. Yeah. >> Okay. And then are you aware of what happened after that? >> No. >> Okay. And you said that on the 10th your lieutenant came in and asked you to go to J Clark. >> Yes. >> And who? >> I'm so I got to stop again. The lieutenant I know you saw his attitude towards retiring. Why would you send him to go look for a missing child? >> What? I know he didn't just develop that attitude on January 10th. He should not have been sent to go interview anybody. His notes suck. >> He admits they suck. >> Oh my god. I I got questions for the lieutenant, too. >> Who is your lieutenant? >> At the time was George Harris. >> Okay. >> I just clarification. You said you were leaving. Are you mean leaving DPS or leaving? >> Yeah. Uh retiring. >> Okay. Thank you. >> Any questions based off of my question? >> No. >> Okay. You were all done. >> He was on the stand for probably 5 minutes total, maybe seven minutes, and now forever nationally to me. And if he goes to trial, he'll be questioned again because he started the investigation. He looks like a piece of [ __ ] He does. And I'll be cursed on here a lot, but that's what he looks like. He his whole life, his whole culmination of his career, this is all we know of you. This is what we're exposed to. And you just look like a piece of crap. And again this time people would call forensic tech Margaret Lvala. >> [cough] [clears throat] >> for record. Okay. I was trying to type this, but I I'm I'm taking too long and I got to get caught up on my notes. So, they the the family could sue him, but here's the problem. The family failed Naziah. Um, and also, I don't know if they have enough that they actually get anything. like this is just a bad attitude to have. But I don't, you know, I don't know if it's enough to sue somebody. Like anybody can be sued. And since I don't have that background, I hope that one day they have that kind of background, but I don't I don't I don't know if there's enough to go off of suing him. But I know he sucks. He Yeah. Well, that's the thing. He was retiring. I don't know if you should send out people that's about to retire the next day or within so much time to do something anything serious. Just desk duty and let it keep rolling. >> Raise your right hand. >> You swear to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth. >> Yes, ma'am. >> Watch your step. [clears throat] >> Good afternoon. Could you please state your name for the record? >> Margaret Lavalo. >> And where are you employed? Uh, currently I'm employed with the Mcome County Medical Examiner's Office. >> And when did you start there? >> Uh, in July of 2024. >> And before starting there, where did you work? >> I worked uh with the Detroit Police Department as an uh forensic technician. >> Okay. And how long had you had that job? >> I was there for about six years. >> Okay. And what as a forensic technician, what are your roles and responsibilities? >> Uh we would respond to scenes uh in the city of Detroit. We would take photos, collect evidence, uh search for evidence, and then compile a report based on our findings. >> And I want to take you back to March 14th of 2024. Were you working with Detroit police uh as a forensic tech at that time? >> Yes, ma'am. And were you working alone or with a partner? >> Pat, I was working alone. >> And I want to take you to uh the area of 7M and Berg uh send the city of Detroit. >> Yes, sir. >> And uh were you uh dispatched to that location on March 14th, 2024? >> Yes, I was. >> And uh what is it that you did at that location? Uh at that location there was a wooded area uh just south of 7 Mile to the west of Berg and we searched that wooded area for uh evidence related to a potential missing person. >> Okay. And what is it that you did when you searched? >> I'm sorry. What was that? >> What is it that you do when you search an area? >> Uh we will canvas the area in an ordered fashion. uh myself along with the other officers that are on scene, we are looking for things that are are out of the ordinary or might suggest uh that something had taken place at that location. >> And did you know what you were looking for at that location? >> We were looking for clothing and um clothing and shoes. >> Um and did you uh take any photos? >> I did. >> And did you collect any evidence? >> I did. >> Okay. And I want to show you anime access to close exhibit 14. >> Yes. >> Show the market people's proposed exhibit 14. Um it's a PowerPoint. Could you tell me um do you recall going to this area? >> Yes ma'am. >> Okay. And these photos uh there are 29 of them. Um, do they fairly and accurately depict uh the scene of Seven Mile and Berg as you saw it that day back on March 14th, 2024? >> Yes, they did. >> And your honor, I move for the admission of people's proposed exhibit 14. >> No objection. >> Okay, they'll be admitted. >> Thank you. >> Did you end up um finding any evidence? >> Yes, ma'am. What evidence did you find? >> Uh, we collected a, uh, pink jumpsuit, uh, like a bodysuit style, and then a black hoodie that had a pair of white headphones in one of the pockets. Uh, some gloves, a towel, and a pair of red, black, and white gym shoes. Okay. >> And your, may I publish? >> Yes. allow [clears throat] me. >> Okay, try And what uh so this is in people's exhibit 14. This is going to be photo uh two. What is it that we're that we have here? >> So this is the photo card that we would take at the uh beginning of processing any crime scene. It includes the date, the time, the location uh that we are responding to, as well as who is the uh current officer in charge that uh ordered us out to that location. uh the crime or suspected crime that we're investigating as well as my name, the code that I'm working, and the report number that is assigned to that case. >> Okay. Um now, I'm going to not go through all 129 photos here. I'm going to show you some I want to reference. Uh this is for record purposes. Photo 30. What do we see here in photo 30? >> Uh we are looking west uh down. So, that fence on the uh left of the photograph is the fence for an abandoned building at the uh south end of a parking lot on the west side of Berg. Uh we are looking west towards the Rouge River into that wooded area. Uh you can see what is uh that pink jumpsuit in the background of the photograph. >> Okay. And in 33, what do we see here? Uh that is one of the uh black, red, and white gym shoes that we collected from the wooded area that I have previously stated. >> Okay. And would it be fair to say that's a a left foot shoe? >> Uh yes. >> Okay. >> And [clears throat] in picture 35, what do we have here? >> Uh that was a photograph of the inside of the shoe of it, uh size tag. >> And in 37, what do we see here? Uh again, we are still looking in that wooded area. That is the black jacket uh that was collected. It is towards the front of the photograph kind of behind that tree branch. >> And in 42, uh >> there's a closeup of the black hooded jacket that we recovered. >> Okay. And would it be fair to say that you opened up the jacket or was this how you saw it? >> Uh we did open up the jacket to examine it. Yes. Okay. And in 45, what's in 45? >> Oh, so that is looking in one of the pockets of the jacket. Um, >> and can you see what's inside the pocket at that point or no? >> Uh, that photograph I believe there is a paper and um might be a pair of headphones. >> Okay. >> And in 47 looking at there. So yes, that is the paper and the pair of headphones that was recovered from that pocket. >> Okay. >> And 50. >> So that is going to be the hood of that hooded jacket. Uh we noted that there are several holes in the jacket um of unknown origin. >> Yep. In 52, what do we see here? >> Um again, we are looking into the wooded area. Uh you can see that pink jumpsuit that is stuck in the the branches of those trees. >> And in 63 uh again a closer shot of that pink jumpshoot >> in 78. What do we see here? >> That is the uh right foot of the red black and white shoe that was recovered that was located in the trees near that suit. >> Okay. And is that fair to say the right foot? >> Yes. >> And 79. What do we have here? >> Uh that is a photo of the inside uh tag of that shoe to show its size. >> And an 88. >> That is the pink jumpsuit that we recovered >> and 89. >> Uh that's a photo of the size and the label of that jacket. Sorry jumpsuit >> and in 120 >> that is a photo of the rude river. >> Okay. >> Um I am going to say this Miss Queen Liz just to from the articles from the conclusion that was drawn she was probably already killed at this point. Um, she >> I I don't know if they carelessly would have placed her things like that or anything, but um I don't know how to put it, but I don't I don't think I don't know if she necessarily dropped those items. But I get what you're saying with it being one shoe and stuff like that. But I guess I'll say in my mind, the way I was looking at it is she had already she had already been been killed. But it could be that cuz we don't know the circumstances of how it happened. Of course, he lured her to meet him. I know that much cuz he had been avoiding her text for a little bit once he found out she was pregnant. And then he finally um you know he was uh googling how to terminate pregnancies you know basically without going to the hospital and stuff like that. So it still could be cuz the end is that she was killed. We don't know how how or why the clothes were placed like that. So I I'm just in my brain I see where I was going but that doesn't mean that's how it happened. That's just they have identified that stuff that she had the day she went missing and things like that. Um, so how close was the Rouge River, I guess, to the area that you were searching? >> Uh, so there's there was a large parking lot just off of the west side of Berg [snorts] and then there was an embankment leading down to the river. I would say less than 500 ft. What condition was the evidence um that we just saw in the photos? What what was the condition of it? >> Uh it was wet. It was dirty. Uh it was currently raining when we were out at that scene. So >> um what did you do with the evidence uh once you photographed it? >> Uh once it was photographed, we collected it or I collected it and took it from the scene. The items that were wet, we then brought to the Detroit Police Department uh evidence garage where we have a drying chamber so that that evidence could be dried in a safe, secure, and uh way so that uh any type of DNA evidence could be preserved. And then once that evidence was then dried, it was packaged and processed and uh submitted to uh the DPD uh property unit. And you would have been the one who uh placed those items in the drying chamber. >> Yes. >> And are you also the one who placed them on evidence afterwards? >> Yes. >> Nothing further. >> Thank you. >> Good afternoon. afternoon >> to I believe you said that it was raining on the day that you were dispatched out to this location at the site. >> That is correct. >> Had been raining most of the morning to [clears throat] >> the best of my recollection. >> Um when you were you were dispatched out by somebody at DPD. >> That is correct. >> Um when you arrived at the site, were there already people on scene? >> Yes, ma'am. >> Uh how many people would you say? >> Approximately 10. >> 10. Were they all um Detroit police officers or were there other people there as well? >> Um everyone that I spoke with was with the Detroit Police Department. >> Okay. >> But you can't Could you say for sure certain that everybody there was DPD? >> No. >> Um you were notified prior to leaving or when you got there maybe um what evidence or what items you were actually looking for? >> Uh they told us we were looking for clothing. >> Okay. Um, were you under the impression that somebody had seen something and wanted you to come out and and photograph it and tag it? >> Yes. >> Okay. Um, so you weren't the first person out there to see it? >> That is correct. >> Do you know who originally had seen the items? >> I do not. >> Did So you didn't speak with anybody about where they initially located them? I spoke with the officers that were at that scene that called me out to that scene and they directed me to where that evidence had been located. >> Okay. >> Um but you can't say for sure where the items were located before you had gotten there. Fair to say. >> Correct. >> Did you see anybody else handle those items? >> No. >> Um but again, you couldn't say for sure that nobody did. >> I can't say what happened before my arrival on the scene. Okay. Um, one of the items was a black hoodie, right? >> That is correct. >> Uh, fair to say that it was it appeared pretty weathered. >> Yes. >> Um, I think the report notes that there's spiderw webs on it. >> Yes. >> Um, some detritus leaves, that kind of thing. >> Yes. >> Um, there was also a pink bodysuit. >> That is correct. >> Now, that was not on the ground, correct? >> No. >> That was in some branches a distance away. >> That is correct. >> About how far away were those two items from one another? Um, not that far, but I couldn't give an estimate right now of distance. >> Okay. Yeah. I don't want you to guess. Um, fair to say that the jumpsuit didn't necessarily appear similarly weathered to the hoodie. >> No, it did not. >> Um, it did have some like dirt or stains on it. >> It did. Yes. >> But it wasn't quite as weathered, I guess. Same word I used, >> I would say. So, yes. >> Okay. Um, so you collected the items. >> When you did so, did you wear disposable gloves? >> I did. >> Did you wear a new pair of gloves for each item that you collected? >> I did. >> Okay. >> And each item went into a separate bag. >> That is correct. >> Um, it's got its own tag. >> Yes. >> And then you yourself drove them to this evidence garage? >> Yes. >> Um, now this evidence garage, where is it at? >> It's located at 11631 Mount Elliot in the city of Detroit. And you yourself um check them in at the garage. >> Yes. >> What is the process for that? >> So we it is placed on in our evidence tracker system and there is a label in there to say that it is at the garage for drying. So it was noted that it was that was where it was going to be. The drying chamber is in a locked room and then the chamber itself is also locked. So the key was uh acquired from my sergeant, my supervisor to get into that room. The items were then hung up in a way that they were not touching each other. They did not come into contact with uh each other during the drying process. Then the chamber was locked back up. The door to the room was locked and the key was returned to my supervisor. Then after 24 hours, then I returned to then collect that evidence where it was all packaged individually in a their own uh sorry bag and then that was then taped, secured and turned over to property and you did all that yourself? >> Yes, ma'am. >> So when you um took each of the excuse me took each of the items out of their respective bags again, did you wear disposable gloves? >> Yes, ma'am. >> Did you change those gloves every time you handled a different piece of evidence? >> Yes, ma'am. Um, and then when you recollected them, you put them in trash bags. >> Yes. >> Um, and you again used disposable gloves. >> Yes. >> And did you use different ones every time you >> Yes. >> handled each item? >> Yes, ma'am. >> Do I have anything else? Thank you. >> Just briefly, um, when you place these items on evidence, are they each given like a specific evidence tag number? Yes. >> Okay. And could we just go through those really quick? If you have a report, >> I do. >> Okay. Um if you need to refresh your memory at all, um please let me know. And if you want to refer to your report um to refresh your memory, just let us know. Okay. >> Um so for the um red, black, and white Nike gym shoes, um those were placed in evidence. >> Yes. >> And do you recall what tag number they were? >> Okay. I'll go ahead and uh skip over some of this since they're just recalling tag numbers and not so much what they found right now because I know that's more for them that they'll need that. But for us, I think we'll be okay not knowing the tag number. So, I'll skip ahead a little bit. >> Okay. >> Um what about that pink bodysuit? >> The Okay. Um what were the other items? Uh there was a pair of gloves that was recovered uh from the wooded area as well and a uh brown, blue, gray towel. It was a dirty towel. A dirty wet towel from the near the parking lot. >> Okay. And did you place that towel on evidence? >> Yes. >> What number did you place that on? >> Uh may I refresh? >> Yes. >> So the towel was 82. >> Okay. And what about those gloves you were talking about? The gloves were 83. Of course, that was recovered from that wooded area as well. >> Okay. And was that an evidence also? >> Yes, ma'am. >> Okay. And what was that post? >> May I crush? >> Thank you. >> Thank you, ma'am. >> All right. Let's see here. Step. Raise your right hand. >> Do you swear to tell the truth, the truth? The truth. >> Thank you. Could you say your name for the record? >> Tata Moore. >> And >> Okay. depending on um how far I can get. We might have to stop at like after we finish looking at Tlesia Moore's um testimony. It kind of just depend because the sister is after her. But uh just Yeah. My energy, I'm telling y'all. >> Excuse me, Miss Mo. I'm going to ask you a couple questions, but first I want to ask you, do you know someone by the name of Cordell Wright? >> I do. >> And how do you know Mr. Wright? >> He is the father of my nephew, my 17-year-old nephew. So, your sister's son? >> Yes. >> Gotcha. >> Um, and is that how you met Mr. Wright? >> Your sister? >> Yes. >> Okay. And in what context is your relationship with Mr. Wright? How did you know him? Um, did he ever do anything for you? Things like that. >> Um, he fixed my mother's car. He worked on her car. >> Okay. And what type of car does your mother drive? >> A Jag. A red Jaguar. >> And what's your mom's name? >> Jack on a candle. and current or going back to January of 2024, where were you living at the time? Not your specific address, just the city. >> And did who else lived with you in Italy? >> My mom and my son. >> Okay. [clears throat] >> And would Mr. Wright ever come out to Ipsellani to fix your mom's car, your her Jaguar? >> Yes. >> How often did he do that? >> Like a couple times. At least at least two times. Two times. >> [clears throat and cough] >> And was that around January of 2024? >> That was the last time. >> In January. >> And when he would go out there, would he bring anyone with him? >> This last time he did. >> What about the last two times? So the before January 9th, him and um someone else came and then on January 9th, they both came. >> Okay. And the person that he brought with him, do you see that person in the courtroom today? >> Yes. And could you point to him and identify a piece of clothing he's wearing? >> Well, I can only see the top of his head right now. >> Are you 100% sure that it's that person? >> Could we have everyone remove their masks? Judge, just for a brief moment. >> If everyone in the courtroom could remove their mask if they have one on, please. >> Miss Moore, do you see the person that Mr. Wright brought with him? >> I do. >> And could you point to an identified piece of clothing he's wearing? uh a green one piece thing. >> For the record, the witness has identified Jarvis, the defendant in this matter. >> Some reflect it. >> Thank you. >> And you said Mr. Butts came out how many times with Cordell? >> Um at at least two. So this last time in January and the time before that. >> Okay. In the time before that, um who was was anyone else with the two of them? >> No. And what were they doing the time before January 9th >> working on the car? We um they I can't remember it was a couple things they had to fix on it and um they came out and did it in the driveway and [clears throat] >> sorry I was just going to say the last time when we got the car towed to the shop and they drove it back up. >> Okay. And so in between the most recent time before January 9th, the Jaguar, correct me if I'm wrong, was towed to Detroit. >> Correct. >> Okay. And then on January 9th, did you see that red Jaguar again? >> Yeah. >> Okay. Who brought that Jaguar out to >> Cordell and Jarvis? >> Okay. And was anyone else with Cordell and Jarvis? >> Yes. >> Who is that person? >> Naziah. And I want to clarify at the time on the 9th when Cordell Jarvis and Nia came, did you know that that was Niah Harris? >> No. >> Do you know that now? >> I do know now. >> Okay. And is that based on information you learned or seen in the news and things like that? >> Well, it was based on when the detectives came to the house to question us. That's when I found out >> Okay. >> who she was. >> But at the time, at the time on the night, you didn't know. >> Is that a no? No. Yes or no? I did not know. >> Now, let's talk about when they came out um on the 9th January 2024. Um what was that interaction? How long did it last? Can you kind of take me through start to finish that their visit and delivering the car? >> So, they came, they delivered the car. Um they tal they were talking to my mom about what was wrong. Gave her the invoice. Um it was just like a a regular day when they came in, they sat on the couch for a few minutes. Um Messiah was sitting in the chair by the TV. We, you know, we spoke very brief. Um asked her if she wanted something to drink. She didn't. My son, my seveny old, six-year-old son ran up to her, the dog, you know, it was just very mellow. They sat there. We talked about the car and stuff. We talked about my nephew. Cordell was trying to wait till um my nephew got out of school, but because he was on tether, they had to leave. They had to leave, so they didn't get to stay long enough for my nephew to come. >> And your nephew would be Cordell's son. >> Cordell's son. Correct. >> Um did you talk to Mr. Butts about Naziah? Did he introduce her or anything like that? >> Um we just asked, you know, hey, you know, we everybody spoke. He said this is his niece. Before they go on, she said they couldn't stay long because he was on a tether. Does anyone know who was on a tether, whether it be Cordell or Jarvis or not sure, but said she said he couldn't stay long because he was on a tether, which would be the ankle bracelet, you know, the little monitoring thing. >> And that was pretty much the basis of it. I cannot remember if he said her name or not, but he did introduce her as his niece. And so just to be clear, not sure about the name, but he said this is his niece about Naziah. >> Is that a yes? >> That's a yes. I'm sorry. >> Okay. >> Um and then after that conversation, well, let me ask you, during that time when they were there, did you notice anything that was unsettling or concerning about Niah? >> No. >> It was just a normal interaction. >> Yes. After that interaction was over, did uh the three of them, Cordell, Jarvis, and Maziah, leave your house? >> Yes. >> Okay. And as far as you know, they were headed back to Detroit, correct? >> Correct. >> Um, when they left, whose car were they leaving in? >> Card. >> And all three of them were in the same car? Yes. >> And you said that they were delivering the Jaguar to your mom or to your house, right? >> Yes. >> Did you see them pull up? Do you know what the driving and seating arrangements was? >> I do not. >> I have nothing. >> Good afternoon. So you you're technically not related to Cordell, right? >> Correct. >> That's just the uncle of I'm sorry. He is the father of your nephew. >> Okay. How would you say your relationship is with Mr. Wright? >> It's like no issues. >> You got along with him well. >> Okay. >> Yes. >> And you know Cordell worked as a mechanic, >> correct? >> Okay. And how long has he worked on your vehicles? Was this something new or had he worked on your vehicles previously? >> I think he might have [clears throat] changed the oil on one of my cars a couple years back, but not not that frequently. >> Okay. And you knew he had a Did you know he had a shop that he worked out of? >> Yes. >> Okay. Had you been to this shop? >> Yes. >> Okay. And you said that there was a time prior to January the 9th that he came up and worked on the car. Correct. >> Correct. >> And you said that my client was with him that time. >> Correct. >> Do you recall when that was? >> It had to be in the summer. I I cannot recall the exact date, >> but it was summer of 2023. Yes. >> Okay. >> And that was the first time you had seen Jarvis But? >> Yes. >> Did you say anything to him that day? >> Yes. >> Yes. We talked about me being a member of Zeta and that he had a cousin or somebody that was a Zeta. Um, we all went to O'Reilly's to get some parts or something for the car. Stopped and got something to eat, came back, but it was very mellow. Like, >> so that summer of 2023, you had a a fairly decent conversation with them. Correct. >> Correct. >> And it lasted for a a period of time. Correct. >> Correct. So on January 9th when you saw him, you knew who he was, >> correct? >> You you had to recognize him because you had to spend time with him. Correct. >> Correct. >> Okay. So you had the car and you knew that they that he was partnered with Cordell at the shop. Correct. >> Correct. >> Okay. So on January 9th, when did you have the car towed down to his shop? I think we had it till maybe like the 4th or the 5th. >> So it was there from the 4th. Okay. And it was the night that they brought it back. >> Correct. >> Okay. Do you know approximately what time the car was brought back? had to be before 3:30 p.m. >> It was 3:30. >> No, no, it had to be before 5:30 because my sister got off of work at 5:30. So, >> mid afternoon. >> Okay. But you're not sure the exact time? >> I'm not sure the exact time. >> Was it light or dark outside? >> It was still light out. >> Okay. And they came up um they pulled the Jaguar in first, the driveway. >> Correct. >> Right. And then Cordell's car was behind us, >> I believe. So, >> okay. When they pulled up, did you see them exit the vehicles? >> No. >> Okay. So, you don't know who was driving? >> I don't. >> Okay. So, at that point, they came into the house, correct? >> Correct. >> And um did they all walk in together >> or did Okay. So, >> Cordell came in followed by Jarvis. Correct. I can't tell you the exact I don't know I don't know if Niah walked in first or Jarvis walked in first. >> Okay. And this young lady and to be fair you didn't know who she was. >> Not at all. >> Do you recall what she was wearing when she came? >> I think she had on a jacket. Um but I I can't really >> don't recall. >> No. >> Okay. Do you recall what any of them had on that day? >> Not really. >> Okay. So, do you recall without going into your house, was it was it dark light in your house? Were the lights on? >> The lights were on. >> Okay. And you have a fairly large living room. >> Yeah. >> Okay. So when they came in, you said that Nazire sat next to the television. >> So yeah, like if you if when you're coming in, there's like a red cabinet type thing. The TV sits on top of it and then there's a chair right like a I don't know, a chair uh sitting right next to it and that's where she was sitting. >> Okay. And when she came in, did she introduce herself? She did not. >> Okay. So, she came in, sat down, right? >> We offered her the seat. Like came in, Cordell said hello. He was doing most of the talking. Jarvis said hello. Said, "This is my niece." Then was like, "You know, y'all have a seat." >> Okay. >> Cordell sat on the couch. There's a couch this way and then a long couch this way. >> I'm sorry. Go ahead. And I was just going to say I believe that they were both on this couch. Naziah was in the chair and me and my mom were on the longer couch. >> So your mom was there, >> correct? All right. And you all were conversing, correct? >> Correct. >> And it's fair to say that you weren't conversing with Naziah. Correct. >> No, >> you were conversing with Jarvis. I'm sorry. You were conversing with Cordell. >> Cordell and Jarvis about the car and the invoice that they brought. >> All right. And you said at some point um your son came up and was talking with Misiah. >> Correct. >> Okay. And how long did this conversation last? >> Like all of our conversation, >> right? How long were they there? >> Probably between like 30 45 minutes. >> Okay. And I'll be [clears throat] honest, as I'm sitting here listening and understanding her minimal connection to not minim, she's key in the fact that she saw Naziah with Jarvis and Cordell, right? But I mean, in the sense of her not knowing who Naziah is. I'm sitting here listening and I'm like, I can understand for her why she may not think too much of it. like cuz if someone's with that they say that's their you know that's their uncle and you know like kids hang out with their aunts and uncles and stuff. So for her and for this being the minimal interaction that she's had um she's great for time and placement but I don't put too much on her like I do though the family some of those family members and stuff like that. That's what I'm thinking right now. It's like it's just someone that they happen to have a kid with them that you know they claim is family or whatever and she only has a loose link to Cordell, not Jarvis. Jarvis is like just a rot along to Cordell at that point. Um I'm listening to her but I don't have you know it's just not she just happened to be a customer. Her mom was a customer. >> Maybe maybe a hour. >> And while they were there you didn't notice anything and I think you've already mentioned this. You didn't notice anything out of the ordinary. Correct. >> Correct. >> Did you see Jarvis Buts conversing with Nziah Harris? >> No. >> So, they didn't have any conversation? >> No. >> Okay. And you didn't notice anything awkward or out of the ordinary between the two? >> Correct. I didn't notice anything. >> So after about an hour, they left. Correct. >> Correct. Was it light or dark? >> It was still fairly light. >> All right. And they got into they got into Cordell's car. Correct. >> Correct. >> You don't remember this evening. I think you've already >> But was Cordell driving? >> Correct. Okay. So that day you didn't think anything out of the ordinary happened. Correct. >> Correct. >> And at some point you were contacted. Correct. >> Correct. >> When were you contacted? >> Well, we were contacted by Cordell the next day because when we paid the invoice, it was $70 short. So, we had to get Jarvis's cash app to send the rest of the money. So, that was the last part of the conversation. And then the detectives came. I want to say the end of March. >> So, the end of March. So, >> I believe I don't I don't know the exact day, but it was it was it was at least a month or two later. And it was when the detectives came is when you found out that the person that was in your house was Naziah Harris. Correct. >> Correct. >> All right. And did they tell you that this person was Nia Harris? >> They asked me if I knew who she was and um they asked me if I knew who Cordell was. They showed me a picture of Mr. Buzz. They asked me if I knew who all these people were. And um they asked me if I knew her name and I did not know her name at that time. >> Okay. And they told you her name? >> Honestly, I don't know. >> Okay. And at any point, did you look up why they were there or look up any information about this case? >> Yeah. After they left. >> After they left. Okay. And what did you look up? >> Objection relevance. >> I just want to see where her information came from. >> As long as the results of what she looked up, >> I want to see the information that she had. Does that go into her testimony? >> Go ahead. >> There's obviously that there's podcast out that are a bit unfavorable. >> It's not obvious. I I don't know. >> Okay. You don't know. Okay. Where what did you look up? >> I looked up uh I looked up Mr. Butt's um Otis record. >> Okay. >> But I tried to type in his name. I typed in Cordell's name. Tried to see if anything came up. At that time there wasn't anything posted but um I didn't find much you know other than his record. >> Okay. >> Just one more thing. No further questions. >> Yeah. >> Okay. So, hold on. Hold on. So, she I'm reading put my kicks up's comments because according to what's her name? Taslesia. She said she didn't know Nazia's name at the time, but she of course had seen her because Nazia was with Jarvis and his business partner, Cordell Wright, who she had the kind of connection with Cordell Wright cuz Cordell was the father of her nephew, um, her sister's kid. And then she's saying that she didn't know her name, but she looked up some things later after the detectives came and questioned her about Naziah, but put my case up to saying, if I recall, she was the one who called and told the police she had seen Naziah. So, she probably would have at least known Nziah's name from seeing the missing stuff that was going around Detroit about Nziah to contact the um the detectives or the detectives somehow trace back that Naziah at some point had been with Cordell and Jarvis because that's weird if she does say I did not know Naziah's name until the detectives came. if she was the one that reached out to the detectives about Naziah because if you see a missing kid notice it's also gonna say the kid's name. So, put my kid kicks up. Let me know where your thoughts are going with that with your comment. Let me know where your I'm just trying to see if I'm following what's going on cuz she said she didn't know her name till the detectives uh said it and then she started looking stuff up after they left her house. but she wouldn't know her face because Desiah was at her house with Jarvis and uh Cordell fixing up her mom's car. >> Um Miss Moore, Mr. Reagans was just asking you about information that you looked up and things like that. When the police were in at your house though, when the detectives were at your house, um first, do you know if those were Detroit police officers? Yes. Detroit police detectives. >> Detectives. Okay. And they you said that they showed you a picture of in court. You said Nisiah, right? >> Say one more time. >> They showed you a picture of Nazisiah at that time. Correct. >> Correct. >> Did you identify that picture when the police were there as Niah Harris? Did you say her name? >> No. I said that's the mechanic's niece. >> You So, just to be clear, you identified her as the girl that was at your house. Correct. >> The defendant Jarvis. >> Correct. >> Okay. >> And that was before you had looked up any information. >> Correct. Cuz I didn't know anything until the detectives came to the house. >> And while Naziah and Jarvis and Cordell were at your house, um you said Naziah was sitting next to the TV. >> Mhm. Is that >> Yes. >> And did Naziah during that 30 minutes to an hour ever get up and leave, use the restroom or anything like that? >> No. >> Okay. So, I'll stick with what I've heard come out of her mouth. And so far, what I've heard her actually say is she she didn't know anything about Naziah until the detectives came. But when they showed her a picture, oh, that makes sense, too. Okay. They showed her a picture, she's like, "Oh, that's that's Jarvis's niece." And they probably knew to come to her house because Cordell is the one that I think had on an ankle monitor. So, that would track his whereabouts. and they like, you know, was Jarvis with you on this date this time? So, it would track back to her and her mom's place. So, I could see how they could get to her house without her contacting them first. So, the only thing I've heard her testify to is that when the detectives came, she saw her picture and she was like, "Oh, that's Jarvis's niece." I haven't heard her say uh she called them first to say um she had seen her or something like that. We'll see. But that's what I'm trying to go with what's coming out her mouth to try to keep what's going on straight. And you mentioned earlier that Cordell was on a tether and that's the reason he had to leave, right? >> Correct. >> Do you know what Cordell's tether hours were at that time? Like what time he had to be back home by? >> I don't know. Um, how far of a drive is it from Detroit to Ipsland? >> Probably about 40 minutes. >> And what was the reason that Cordell had to leave again >> because he said he had to be back in the house for his te. >> Okay. So, it seemed did it seem like he was in a little bit of a rush to get back or he was cutting in close maybe with that dry 40 minutes? No, I think he had whatever he needed to do and he just wanted to make sure he was in the city on time. >> But is it fair to say that he would have left somewhat closer to his cuto off time if that's the reason he left or that he said? >> I think that calls for speculation. I was going to say I I don't I'm sorry. >> Do you want to respond? >> If she knows I I think it's a close call. >> If if you know the answer. >> I don't I I don't know. I can't say. >> I'm going to go back just a little bit to hear the question that was asked of her. uh just to make sure I'm not missing something crucial because they've been letting him question really smoothly and then that question comes up and then they're like hold on now >> but is it fair to say that he would have left somewhat closer to his cuto off time if that's the reason he left or that he said >> I think that calls for speculation on her part >> I was going to say I'm sorry do you want to respond >> if she knows I I think it's a close call >> if if you know the answer. >> I don't I I don't know. I can't say. >> I really >> Okay, you are done testifying. >> Thank you. >> All right, we made it through to try to get to his sister. So, we're I think she's next. Yep. So, I'mma let them sit there and talk talk talk. We're going to skip to her being on the stand. And I I feel well again I'm trying to match articles with stuff I haven't actually watched yet. So this is the first time for me watching it. But I believe they said this is her sister or his Jarvis Buts's sister. So we'll go ahead and start there. >> [clears throat] >> 42. >> And do you know his birthday? >> Yes. >> When's his birthday? >> November 21st, 1982. >> And do you see drivers in the courtroom today? >> I saw him walking in. >> Okay. And can you point to him and tell me the color of the clothing that he's wearing? >> He has on believe it's dark green shirt. He's sitting behind the lady to the side of you. >> Okay. And your honor, would the record reflect the witnesses identify the defendant in this case? >> So reflected. And just to be clear, you said I saw him walking in. You [snorts] saw him when you were walking in or when he was walking in? >> When I was walking in just now. >> Thank you. And Miss, where did you know Jarvis to work? >> Uh, he worked at a shop on Warren and left um called Franks and then he moved to a shop on Hopper and Connors. I don't know the name of it. And Miss Blutz, do you remember talking to Detroit police back on February 26th of 2024? >> Yes. >> Okay. >> And what's the reason that you went and talked to Detroit police? [snorts] >> I have reason to believe that um I saw Nazia the day she went missing. >> Okay. Tell me about that. What's well what makes you believe that you saw Niah on the day she went missing? >> Where did the moment start? >> So from the very beginning where where is it that you think you saw Nia? >> At the shop on Har. >> Okay. And whose shop is that? my brother Jarvis Buzz and um his partner. >> Okay. >> What's the reason you were at your brother's shop that day? >> Uh something was wrong with the car that I was driving and I just needed him to check it out to make sure it was safe for me to drive. >> Okay. Um do you recall about what time did you go to Jarvis's shop that day? Uh about 4:00 p.m. give or take. A few minutes. >> Okay. And about what time did you leave? >> Somewhere between 6 and 6:30. >> Okay. And what is it that you noticed while you were at the shop? >> So, [snorts] it's a two uh car like garage. So, I was sitting outside of the shop in my car because they were working on another car on the inside. Um, as I sat there for the time that I was there, I kept seeing a little girl get in and out of his truck, going to the gas station, and going back to his car. >> Okay. So, I'm going to stop you right there. Whose car are we talking about? >> My brother. >> Okay. And what kind of car was it? >> Uh was it the Cadillac Escalade? >> Okay. Do you remember what color? >> Uh kind of like a pearl white off white cream color. >> Okay. And you said you described this this as a like a two garage shop. >> Yes. >> Okay. And >> I want to approach with people's uh exhibit seven. >> Okay. Now, Miss Books, do you recognize what is it we're looking at in people's exhibit at 7? >> Yes. >> Okay. What is that? >> That is the shop. >> Okay. >> Right in the middle. >> And where at were you parked when you um saw someone getting in and out of truck >> in front of the car doors of the garage? Right here. I was parked facing I don't know what direction it was going towards gra. I was parked in front but outside. >> Okay. So you were kind of parked parallel with the road. >> Yes. >> Okay. Um can you draw a T where your truck was? >> My car. >> Yeah. Your car was >> Yes. And then put an arrow the way you were facing. And where is it where that Jarvis's truck was? Just put a J where Jarvis's truck was. And what what way was his truck facing? >> It was facing my direction. So the front was towards >> towards you. Okay. So put an arrow for [clears throat] that direction. Okay. >> Now, do you get a look at this little girl that you see getting in and out of his car? >> I saw her [snorts] um as she was walking. I never saw her face. >> Did you see any clothing? >> I did. >> Okay. Did you Did anything about the clothing stick out to you or that you remember? >> I just remember her having on a colorful jacket. >> Okay. And um where what what door what side do you remember seeing her getting in and out of Jarvis's truck or did it change? I I don't really remember. >> Okay, that's okay. Um, so you said you mostly remember a jacket, a colorful jacket. >> Yeah. >> Okay, now I'm going to show you what's marked as people's exhibit 2, which is already admitted and people's proposed exhibit 10. You want to approach? >> Yes. >> Thank you. handing you smartest people's exhibits, too. >> I'm [clears throat] just mostly just looking uh and listening, obviously. Um it's a lot to take in when you're actually watching it for the first time. But she does she looks disgusted with her brother. I don't know how much she did or didn't know yet or um anything besides the fact that she saw Nazi on the day she went missing. Excuse me. But she looks disgusted with her brother. her her facial expression, her body language is just like she's recalling what she's learned about him. But my here's my thing, too. Oh, I just raised a question in my head. Naziah is not his first victim. And I wonder, did she know of his other history? Because as the sister, if she knew of his other history, or as an adult that knew of his other history, I would always keep raising flags to the guardian, to somebody like, "Hey, he has a past. I know it's my brother. It is what it is." Um, this little girl that's with him by herself. Like, y'all need to be watching your little girl. Like, hey, he has a past. So, I do wonder does she know about his past? Because again, Nia is not the first victim. intent. Okay. Do you recognize anything in those photos? >> Yeah. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> What is it that you recognize? >> Right here in this jacket. >> And for the record, you're pointing up in channel one. Um and you recognize this this like pink colorful jacket. >> Yes. >> Okay. And and that's in people's exhibit 10. You're honor for the admission of people's proposed exhibit 10. That's exhibit 10. Is that fair? Is that a fair and accurate depiction of uh the the jacket that you saw that day? >> Yes. >> I move for the proposed uh people's exhibit 10. >> Any objection? >> No objection. >> Okay. It'll be admitted as people's exhibit two. >> Okay. And in people's two is that also uh um where is the uh what you recognize people's exhibit two? [snorts] It looks [snorts] like uh channel two here maybe. >> Okay. >> Facing the back. >> Yeah. >> Okay. [snorts] And you recognize the jacket in this photo too, right? >> Yes. >> It's the little blurry button looks the same. >> Okay. >> And what about in channel one of exhibit two? >> It will be this one right here. >> Okay. And it's fair to say that's the back of a jacket or seems to be the back of a jacket. Okay. Thank you. And you said that you saw this little girl with this jacket on getting in and out going into the gas station? >> Yes. >> Okay. Uh did you know who this little girl was at the time? >> No. >> Okay. Um is there a time that you ever get out of your car? >> Yes. >> And what do you do? Um, I needed to use the restroom. So, I asked his partner uh if I could use the restroom. He told me to go and tell them in the gas station. >> I do want to say also as to right before Jarvis's sister was testifying and now I'm listening to uh Tana. I'm wondering how much did Cordell know and I know he's going to come on the stand. How much did he know and how much was he a part of anything? Because Cordell's already got his own past. Doesn't mean PDF pass, but just has his own path enough past enough to have an ankle monitor and then um h I just feel like a guy would slip up more in front of a guy. So, I'm just wondering, did he see stuff? So, I am looking forward to eventually hearing him on the stand. Although he probably I don't think he'd say too much, but I do just want to know. I want to see what questions they ask him. >> And as I was walking towards the gas station, she was walking in front going [snorts] into the gas station. >> Okay. So about how far in front of you was she? I would say maybe where the [snorts] giant gray blazer is behind you. Maybe a little bit farther. Not pretty sure, but that distance >> from where you are to him. >> Yeah. >> Okay. And boy, I'm really bad at estimates. Um >> 20 25 ft. >> I'd Yeah, I would agree. About 20 to 25 ft. Um, and you said you you never got a chance to see this little girl's face. >> No. >> Okay. Um, was there anything else about her that you can remember? [snorts] >> I just remember her being kind of small, like outside of just seeing her get in and out of the car when I was walking towards her, I was like, she's tiny. And I just remembered the code. >> Okay. Um, tiny like in what way? like tiny skinny, short, >> tiny, skinny, and short. >> Okay. >> I said she looks small for a 13-year-old. That's what I was thinking. Every time I see her, I mean, she looks and I know like uh ages of kids, they kind of mel together in certain age ranges, but she didn't her face to me didn't look like a 13-year-old. Then, um her stature very much, you know, and kids are kids. She's still obviously a kid at 13, but um she just if if no one gave me context, I would have thought she was like 10. >> And did you ever ask um Jarvis who the little girl was? >> Yes. >> And what did he tell you? He told me and I can't remember if it was this exact word or he said it's my partner's niece or he said it was you know what I think they're doing and and they're leading up they're building up leading up cuz they got to get to the text messages and stuff eventually. So right now I think the way they're asking without asking to see if any of the witnesses say it I think they're saying did you notice anything out of place with her today? Cuz if you see if they saw her the day she went missing, that's when she was already pregnant. So, I think they're trying to, you know, like, did did anything stick out to you about her? Did you know anything out of notice anything out of the ordinary about her? I feel like they're asking without leading or like, you know what I mean? They're trying not to give it away if the people didn't already notice on that day. But I do feel like eventually they may get more explicit with asking later on, but they're just kind of what did you notice about her at that time? King's niece. >> Okay. >> You knew who he was referring to? >> Yes. >> Okay. >> Did you think anything of that at the time? >> No. >> Okay. [snorts] And what is it that made you think something? Did was there a time where you made where you thought something different? >> Uh yes. >> Okay. What is it that made you think something different? I received phone call uh well a video call from one of his kids mom and uh I'm sorry what Darlene says the grandma was locking the refrigerator on the kids the mother and daughters ate lobster. I tell you what, I already don't have a good feeling about the grandmother. Doesn't surprise me. When we watch one of the um interrogation videos that we've been watching lately, there's some characteristics that that grandmother exhibits that that uh shows the same in some of those other people where the kids, they're not alive anymore. Like that one mom that was starving her girl, her little girl, and then would say she was stealing food. You're starving her. What do you mean she's stealing food? So, yeah, talking about she was acting out and stuff like that, but no, that grandmother gives me vibes of you're not going to surprise me that that was happening. Now, does someone testify to that on the stand? And I have to keep asking this because so much is going on outside of the trial of people that have personal knowledge or say that they do. So, was that something that came out from someone being interviewed or is that something that came out when somebody was on the stand? She told me about some things that happened on Valentine's Day and then she sent me a video of a podcast about my brother. >> Okay. And what did you do as a result of receiving those things? >> I called Shannon and I asked her for Sergeant Jones phone number. >> Okay. And who's the Shannon that you called? >> His mom. >> Shannon Harris. >> Yeah. >> Okay. There you go. Uh, I'mma get this right. Put my kicks up. There you go. She is, like you said, there's your memory. She's the one that contacted the detectives or the sergeant about her brother. >> Okay. Um, do [clears throat] you do you do anything before you go and talk to Sergeant Jones? >> Yes. >> Okay. What is it that you do? >> Okay. So, [snorts] after having a conversation with uh Shannon Harris and his other kid's mom, um I was informed that his partner King uh I guess something happened where the >> objection. This is hearsay. >> There's not a statement yet. Judge >> being informed. >> I'm not sure what she's even about to say. >> Okay. To the extent that it's in form of someone else's statement. You might have to object in a couple moments. >> You need to speak up. >> If you could stand up and make your objection. >> Yes. Just objection. Objecting to the fact that she was informed of something. It appears this might be hearay. We'll see. >> Could you finish what you were saying? I don't know where you going with this. >> I'm trying to remember where I Okay. So, after talking to uh Shannon Harris and his other kid's mom, um I was informed of some things that had taken place uh that they Valentine's Day. So, uh they told me that his king. >> Okay. >> Okay. So, at this point, this is fair. They told me the lack of personal knowledge to the things that she was informed of. >> Can I finish? >> One second. >> What is an objection here? I'm sorry. >> The witness has to stop talking. So based on those, do you go and talk to someone else? >> Yes. >> Okay. Who do you go and talk to? >> Uh his partner King. >> Okay. And where is it that you go and talk to King at? >> At the shop on Harper Encounters. >> Okay. And without telling me what King said, kind of describe what was your conversation about. Well, I went to see what happened um and what was going on during that time. [snorts] I told him that I had never seen any little girl at uh my brother's shop besides my nieces outside of the little girl that I saw getting out of his truck that day. >> Okay. >> And you told this to who? >> Kane. And who is who is King again? >> His uh business partner. >> Okay. And do you know his government name? >> Uh I believe it's Correl or something like that. I just always called him King. >> Okay. Um, so you went and told him that you hadn't seen anyone out at the shop besides your nieces and then this the one little girl you saw that one day? >> Yes. >> Okay. Um, did you ask him about that little girl? >> Well, I didn't ask him about it. After I said that to him, he told me. >> Judge, your honor, this is going to be her say again. >> Judge, it's going to go to the effect of on the listener. >> There could be an exception. I don't know what she's saying, so you might as well just stay standing up. >> Okay, >> go ahead. Say what you're missing. >> After I mentioned to him that I had only saw my nieces and one particular little girl, he then told me that that was Naziah that I saw that day and I was there. >> So I would have been given now that she has testified to that that it is hearsay and that it is being introduced for the truth. and judge I would say that it's actually statement of identification. >> This is not identification that she personally made. She's just being told she ident she saw that day. So it's she didn't know who it was. Now, on the defensive side on this one, she said, "I never saw the front." Like, she said she never saw Naziah's face. So then to later be able to identify her, I would think that it's exactly how she's saying it. The detective said who you saw that day was Naziah. Probably connecting the tether from earlier at maybe Tlesia's house or somewhere in there of that day. They had enough reason to believe it was Naziah. But I can see how the detective is telling her, "Yeah, that was Naziah." Versus her looking at the picture and saying, "Oh, that's Naziah. That's the girl I saw." Because earlier she said she was getting in and out of the truck. I was walking behind her at the gas station, but I never saw her face. So then to go from never seeing her face to seeing the girl's face, saying, "Yeah, that's her." She already said she never saw Nia's face. >> No idea who this was, that's her identification. >> So it is your thing. >> Okay. So, without saying what King said, um, were you informed of anything about a little girl that you saw on January 9th, 2024? >> Yes. >> Okay. And to your knowledge, Jarvis had told you that that was King's niece. >> Yes. >> Okay. And when you talked to King, did uh did you have reason to not believe what Jarvis told you? >> Who is King? Excuse me. [clears throat] Who is King? What did I miss? Cuz Jarvis said that was King's niece. Who is King in all of this? >> Yes. >> Okay. Do you know your nieces from from Jarvis? >> Sorry. >> Um [laughter and clears throat] >> that's that is a poorly worded question. I am sorry. Um if if that was your niece, would you have recognized her that day? >> Yes. >> Okay. Um and you did not recognize the soul girl as your niece, did you? >> No. >> Okay. What is it that you did after speaking with King that day? [snorts] >> I called Shannon Harris and I asked her for Sergeant Jones phone number. >> Okay. And um did you eventually talk to uh Sergeant Jones? >> Yes. >> Okay. Uh, sorry about that. What day was it that you went to the shop and saw that the little girl? Can I ask you a question? Um, I didn't remember the exact day at that time. >> Okay. What is it that makes you um believe that it was Miss Eye Harris that you saw on that day? I'm not quite sure how to answer what you're asking me. Like um >> that may be a poorly ordered question. I'm sorry. >> Can I just have one second, George? >> Yes. Miss Buts, did you come to learn of the day that you had gone to Jarvis's shop through by going through the locations on your phone? >> Yes. >> Okay. And that's the date that you don't remember off the top of your head right now, but it is revealed in your phone locations. >> Yes. >> Okay. Um, see here. One second. Okay. Okay. Y'all are making sense. Thank you. I missed that part. Okay. So, Cordell goes by King, which of course once he testifies they'll probably ask him, "What other names do you go by?" and all that stuff, but I missed it when she said it. Um, so Jarvis is lying and saying, "Oh, this is Cordell's niece, Cordell's niece, when she sees him." Instead of just, and of course, he had nefarious uh intentions anyway, so why would he tell the truth, but he didn't say this is Shannon's niece, which his sister would know Shannon cuz Shannon is the mother of her niec's, nephews, or whoever. So yeah, to not to like she would eventually maybe have even seen Naziah with Shannon, but he said, "Oh, this Cordell's Cordell's niece." So he probably at that time was already planning on trying to hide the fact that she was pregnant and had other plans then. Oh, let me finish my thought. The rest of the thought was in my head. I I'm trying to say that so later when Nia would go missing, his sister maybe wouldn't have been one of the ones to say, "Oh, yeah, I saw her." Because they're looking for Shannon's niece, not Cordell's niece or King's niece. So, that wouldn't have been the same person had she believed, "Oh, that's King's niece, not Shannon's niece." Um, okay. I'mma keep thinking this out. When is it that you went through your phone locations to determine the date? [snorts] >> I'm sorry. Do you need a moment? believe February I think like 24th or the 26th I can't remember the exact date. >> Okay. That's when you would have went through your phone to find those. >> Yes. >> Okay. And um did you also go through that in your interview with Sergeant Jones? >> Yes. >> Okay. And did you give Sergeant Jones permission to look at your location data? >> Yes. >> Okay. And your your phone kind of extraction in general like the to go through your phone for your for the data? >> Yes. >> Okay. Nothing else. Thanks. >> So, you go to the shop where your brother works periodically, right? >> From time to time. Yes. >> You'd been there prior to the day we've been talking about today? >> Yes. >> A couple times at least? >> Yes. >> And you'd been back there after? >> Yes. But the day we've been talking about, that's the only time you ever saw a child there. >> That was the only time I saw a child and recognized. >> Okay. So, you had seen other children there before? >> Yes. >> Okay. When you say that you recognize these are who exactly? >> My nieces. >> And when you first arrived at the shop that day, Jarvis told you that he wasn't going to be able to work on your car? No. >> No. Did you ask him if he'd be able to >> judge? I think this calls for here say they can't defend statements of the defendant. >> I'm I'm looking more so for her own statement. Actually, start with her own statement. >> Did you ask him right away if he would be able to work on your car? >> I talked to him prior to coming to the shop. >> Before you arrived, you asked if he could work on your car that day. >> I asked him to look at my car that day. >> Okay. Did you arrive at the shop with the understanding that he would or would not be able to? >> I arrived at the shop knowing that he was going to look at my car. >> Okay. >> Okay. Okay. One of my questions is getting answered. She was real cooperative with prosecution. And then like they said, you know, she let Sergeant Jones go through her phone, take what you need, extract what you need. when when the defense attorney start questioning her is no. It's I said I said this. It's very her she's gotten way more flat. Now I can see the difference where she seemed more sad and and just continuing to realize maybe what her brother did. He had a past. Um but with the defense it's like I'm not about to help y'all. That's what I'm getting from her demeanor and her switch up. Let me know what y'all are seeing here. >> One moment. And was that um via text or call or some other way? >> Probably video call. >> Okay. So, a video call a little bit before you headed over >> earlier in the day maybe. >> I'm not sure exactly what time. >> Okay. So that's how you decided that you'd go over later. >> He told me I could come. >> Judge, this is kind of all calling for hearay in a back door way. >> The response is hearsay. Not that she necessarily asked for it, but it is hearsay. >> Sure, we can keep her own. Um, so to be clear, we don't need to talk about what he said to you, but you did a video call to him and in that call, you asked if he could work on your car. You keep saying work on my car. I said look at my car. >> Okay. Look at your car. But you you asked him personally in a video. >> Yes. >> Okay. And that was maybe that morning. >> I don't remember what time of day it was, but it was before I went to him. >> Okay. >> Oh, yeah. She ain't playing with the fence. She is not with them at all. >> Okay. And as you were saying this day, I think you've said you saw some other children there at other times, but this particular child, you only ever saw this child on this particular day. >> Yes. >> And the whole time you were there from your testimony and from that police interview, you said that you never saw her face. >> Yes. >> And then you did also see some new stories about this case. >> Yes. Yeah, in the podcast that you talked about, >> right? There were some podcasts. >> I had already saw her on the news, but I did not know who she was. >> Sure. But that was um by seeing those stories. That's how you started to think. >> Well, I was sent to podcast after some other things that was told to me. That's when I received the podcast. >> So, initially between the day you were at the shop, right, and then until you started to see that news, at first you didn't make this connection that maybe she was anyone in particular? >> Not at all. >> Okay. And then through seeing that that news, those podcasts, that's when you started to think >> that's not the reason why I thought that. >> No, but that's the timing or it's not. I guess you could say that >> that's when you started to at least when you saw those things that's when you started to wonder. >> I was wondering before I saw the podcast. >> Okay. In your police interview that you did, >> did you tell them that at first when you saw the news, you didn't really make a connection >> because of not having seen her face? >> Yes. >> Okay. So that interview was on February 26, 2024, right? >> Yes. >> And you were having some trouble remembering some of the specific details from January 9th at that point. >> Not so much as remembering maybe the order I remembered it in. >> Okay. Okay. Were there some times at least though when you were asked [clears throat] some questions and some details that you had to say I can't remember some things? >> I can't remember now. >> Okay. Would you agree that at least didn't have >> Okay. >> I just probably did. I I guess it would be safe to say because I didn't know. >> Okay. So, you think it's safe to say that at that point in time there were at least some details you were having a hard time, some questions you couldn't answer? I can't disagree. >> It was pretty close in time. Shortly before that police interview, that was when you first started to think that maybe this girl you'd seen at the shop had been Misiah Harris. >> Can I interview that? >> So, the first time you started to think that maybe that child, the one you saw, maybe that was Misiah Harris, that was pretty close in time to the police interview. maybe about a week or so before. >> Okay. I believe does it sound right to you that I think you told the police that it was on the Thursday prior to the interview? >> Whatever the Thursday was after Valentine's Day. >> Okay. So, probably February 22nd. That was the Thursday prior to your interview. >> Okay. And then when you were at the shop, you primarily saw this child while she was inside a truck, right? >> I didn't know it was a child in the truck until she kept getting out. >> Okay. But when you saw her, she was in a truck. >> I saw her getting out the truck. Yes. >> And were you inside your vehicle? >> Yes. >> You arrived in the daylight, right? Yes. [clears throat] >> And that's I think what you're referring to, right? Initially, that's when you didn't yet know somebody was in the truck. >> Can you say that again? >> So, at the beginning, when you first got there, right, you didn't know right away that somebody was in the truck? >> No, I didn't. >> I think you had said before because it was so light outside, it was a bit difficult to see into the truck. >> I wasn't really paying attention to his truck. He was outside of it. >> Sure. >> And then in your police interview, you referred to then seeing a light in the truck and that's when you started to see somebody. >> Yeah, that's when the door opened. >> Okay. So, there's a light turned on and at the same time a door opened. >> That's the reason the light is on. >> Okay. Because the truck door was open. I'm I am glad she's more for the prosecution than the defense. But she she ain't playing with them. Like you said, she is not playing with them, Mary. She ain't giving her nothing. That's the reason her door light would be on in the car cuz the door opened up. And then that lady repeated, she just she just looked at her like you heard what I said the first time. I'm here for it. I'm here for it. >> Yes. Sure. >> And you said that you saw a couple different times her go back and forth to the gas station. >> Yes. >> And only one of those different times you were on your way to the gas station as well? >> Yes. >> But for that whole time she remained in front of you. When I was going into the gas station, she was in front of me. When I walked into the gas station, she went to the left. I went straight and over to the right. >> For that walk over to the gas station, was it getting dark at that point? >> It was already dark. >> Okay. So, I'm guessing the defense is going for she's the sister's verifying she never did get to see Naziah's face. How do we know Nazia for sure was with Jarvis, our client, at this time? Because um you know, she this sister did not see her face. So, it could have been another person. It could have been Cordell's niece, which honestly all you gota do is let's let's get to the family and see if Cordell had a niece that the parents was like, "Yeah, he would he was our niece, our daughter or whoever was with Cordell that day or something." But I feel like they're trying to say she can't positively identify Naziah on her own. And it was more suggested to her that Naziah was the one with Jarvis and Cordell that day. And while she was in the truck, you were not sure exactly which part of the truck this was? >> I can't remember. No. >> Okay. >> So, you understood initially that when you arrived, you'd probably have to wait at the shop sometime. >> Yes. I think you referred to just one other car you worked on first. Is that all there was before you? >> It was actually another vehicle out there, but I don't pay my brother to work on my car, so I had to wait until he was done making his money. >> Sure. >> So, I waited. >> Sure. So, did do you know how many cars he worked on before he got to you? >> I don't remember. >> Okay. Do you know if there were any other customers present in person? Um, I did see someone, I can't remember what kind of car it was in, but it was, I believe, a gentleman, um, that needed to pull into the garage because Jarvis asked me to move my car out the way because I was blocking the garage. So, yes. >> Was this someone you recognized at all? >> No. >> So, in total, other than Jarvis or who you referred to as King, was there anyone present that you recognized that day? No, just came and wandered further. >> So, as you said, the sunset while you were there, do you know about how long it [snorts] was light out before it got dark? >> Well, I got there about 4:00 cuz it didn't take long for it to get dark. I don't remember exact the exact time, but got dark pretty fast. >> Okay. Okay. And then other than when you went to the gas station, were you always at the shop? >> What do you mean? >> So, did you go anywhere else? >> No, I never left. All I did was move my car when he asked me to move my car. And once the driveway was clear, I backed back where I was. I didn't go anywhere else. >> Okay. And when you were present, not going to the gas station, were you always inside your vehicle? >> Yes. Were your doors open or closed? >> Closed. >> Okay. Were your windows up or down? >> They were up unless I asked him something. >> Okay. So, sometimes if you needed to communicate, you just open the window >> or I would call him. Yeah. >> Yes. >> And you were saying today that at one point you did speak to Jarvis about who this girl was? >> Yes. And when you were talking to the police about this, you had said that you weren't sure exactly what his response was. >> What I said was I wasn't sure of the wording. >> Sure. That that's what I mean. >> Okay. >> You you told the police, right, that it might have been King's niece or maybe he said it's my homeboy's niece. >> He cuz he said it was his partner or King's niece, but he definitely said it was someone else's niece. >> Okay. I mean, is it does it sound right to you that you use the term homeboy niece with the police? >> I probably did. >> Okay. >> That's all I'm saying to me. >> And then that's what you continued to think at first, right? At first, you just believe that it was someone else's niece. >> Yes. >> Specifically, you thought it was probably King's. >> That's what I was told. >> Which I guess is we established that King is the same person as Cordell, right? >> Yes. And then, >> yay. I know y'all reassured me already that King is Cordell, right? But they they did it before Cordell had to get on the stand for my sanity. I So now I've had it repeated twice that that his name is King. So it's Cordell and aka King. All right. >> Thought you would listen to some of these podcasts into the news. I listened to his kid's mother and then I watched the podcast. >> Oh y'all, she she she ate with that one cuz see the the defense attorney tried to lean on you heard rumors, rumors, rumors from the podcast. So you start developing a thing about your brother, right? And she was like, "Oh no, I heard from the kids mothers." And then I heard the podcast. I I saw that look she gave her, too. So those are some some things that happened both. >> Yes. >> And [clears throat] then once you started to have this different information you were gathering, then you kind of started to look into it for yourself. >> Yes. >> Do some of your own investigation? >> Yes. >> And then at one point following that, that's when you decided to go back to the shop. >> Yes. >> To speak to Cornell. >> Yes. and to discuss some of these things you've been learning with him. >> Yes. >> You and Jarvis are not particularly close. >> I wouldn't say that we're really distant. I don't see him every day. I don't talk to him every day, but he's my brother. >> Okay. you he's your brother, but you don't have a very close relationship or >> he's my brother. >> Okay. >> What about with his children? Are you close with his children? >> Some of the ones that I know. >> So, he has 13 kids, right? >> I have. >> Jesus Christ. Jesus Christ. He might have 13 kids or more. I'm writing it down in my notes. No wonder she answered how she did. She said I with the ones that I know of or however she just answered that question. I I I kind of suspected he had a lot of kids when just Shannon Harris had five of his kids. I was like, "Oh man, >> no idea." >> Do you have an idea for around how many kids he has? a lot. >> Okay. Do some of them live with different mothers? >> Yes. >> And you don't spend time with all of them? >> No. >> So, which ones do you know? >> I don't want to say their names. They're minors. >> Okay. >> And I don't want to disclose their identity. >> Could you just give I feel you. I feel you. They can ask you a name. You can say yes or no. I understand. We ain't trying to put the kids out there like that. She is no leeway for the defense attorney. I'm here for it. What's her name? Tijana. I'm here for this part. >> But a number instead. >> How many do you know? >> I'm counting. How about eight? >> So when you say eight that you know, does that mean eight that you have like personal contact with? >> I have. >> Okay. When is the last time that you've seen any of them? um two months ago. >> Were you and Jarvis raised by your grandmother? >> For the most part. And were there some events surrounding her death that related to your relationship with Jarvis that impacted some things? >> No. >> Oh, I have no further questions. Thank you. >> Any redirect? >> Oh, she said I know what trick you trying to play. You b not and I'm not saying the lawyer, but whatever Jarvis told that lawyer, the sister knows what angle he was trying to go in and she was like, I'm not playing this game. Whatever it was, we're not about to go down that road so you can blame your behavior on some stupidity. Nope. Nope. Nope. She shut that down quick. >> Yes, judge. >> Okay, let's see. Let's see how she changes now that we got the prosecution back over on this side. Shannon tried to talk to Naziah into getting rid of the baby. Okay, now Auntie Natty, did this come from people being interviewed or did this come from somebody on the stand? I'm not saying I don't um believe it happened. I I already believe Shannon is sorry and the grandma Annette is sorry too. So I ain't but I'm just asking because I'm trying to keep it straight on where it's coming from so I can just for me I'll keep the knowledge but I'm trying to just >> stay with what they presenting at trial and everything. And not that I don't want to know. I'm not saying that I I want to know what y'all are hearing but I'm just trying to keep straight what's coming from what since I'm catching up. goosebots. You said that there was kind of there was there was another reason there was a different reason that you thought that it was Mai that you had saw that that day when you were starting to compile or when you talked to Shannon Harris and then you got the podcast before that you said there was another there was there was other reasons why you had thought that was Nia. So am I speak for Okay. So >> um >> at the time I didn't know. Once I realized that it was a possibility uh that I saw her. There were several reasons that led me to believe um that it was a possibility I was there. And I didn't want to get into detail as far as what I knew before the podcast. But if you would like, I would explain to you why >> I thought these things. >> It's up to you. >> Yeah. Look, she's so fully cooperative now. um for the prosecution for you know trying to get justice for Naziah. She is back open. She is back more um it's almost I don't think the word is submissive. It's more like receptive to instruction is what she has turned back into versus Wald off. Don't play with me. I'm only going to answer exactly what you ask me and you better ask me correctly and don't mix my words up. That's how she was with defense. With this one, it's like, tell me how you want me to answer this question because I got the things I can say, but I'm trying to make sure I don't mess anything up for y'all. >> Approach. >> Yes. Go the hallway. I'm going to discuss I feel so bad for her cuz every time she has to sit and think. Um, and I don't think she's pretending. I know there's some they'll put on, they'll perform and and you can't pick out everybody, but I don't think she's pretending. I think she keeps thinking about what happened to these kids spec um the kids in her family and then and then what happened to Naziah. I really think it just keep hitting her. tomorrow. Okay. [snorts] I'll tell you right now, if I had have just been watching this by myself and not with y'all, my she'd already have me tearing up. She would have she would definitely The only I think it's because I'm trying to be present with my notes and understand I still have to give commentary. Um, and still sometimes it doesn't matter. stuff will get to me. But I'm telling you now, cuz I can feel it like welling up. She her emotions passing on over here on this side. Like she is affecting me. [snorts] [sighs] You need some water, something. Can you get some? >> Oh, yeah. [snorts] >> It's going to be all right. [snorts] I'll be back. [snorts] >> [snorts] >> And sorry, I know my comments I was blocking it, but uh I did think that most of the time he was either figning or, you know, just trying to look down in shame, especially he don't want to see his sister. But he taking notes. He looking down writing and taking notes. [snorts] You need to do some more. >> No, this it like Okay, we are back on the record. Miss But you are still under oath. >> Miss, you go right ahead. >> Thank you. So, Miss But when what are what's the sources of these reasons that you have? Are these things that you know from your personal knowledge? Are these things that you observe yourself? That's why she came back smiling. Did y'all see the prosecutor, the the one that's asking her questions now? How she came back before she got to start asking her questions again? And I'm like, she's smiling. And okay, so if she asked the question in a certain way, it looks like they can bring up how did you have your suspicions about your brother? So there was a win in that in that uh in that room in the judge's chambers. I'm sorry. >> So these these reasons that you you were thinking of are these what are the sources of them? Is it somebody told you something? Is it some something that you saw yourself you observed or a coupling of that? Um I would say both things that I was told and things that I heard. >> Okay. Were there heard heard from Jarvis? >> No. >> Okay. Um were these things that you had already known prior >> prior to >> to to thinking that that was Messiah that you saw? >> I'm sorry. I'm confused on the question. >> So, are these things this the sources that you have for these reasons? Um, are they like things that you have personal knowledge of or are they things that somebody told you about? >> These were things that I was told. Um, I'm trying to understand the question that you're asking [clears throat] me. Um, >> Mr. You're referring to the question before we went into sidebar about her leading up to believing that it was possibly Nia Harris at the shop. Correct. >> Yes. >> Does that help clarify? >> Okay. >> Questioning. >> Yes. >> Okay. >> Okay. So, th those reasons, those things, are those things that you had known before? Were they based on your observations or >> Well, these were things that I were told. Um, and after asking the questions that I needed to ask, I came up with the conclusion that it was a possibility that Naziah was the little girl that I saw that day. >> Okay. Thank you. Um you said that when you were um parked at drivers's shop that it was it was getting dark out. >> Yes. >> Okay. Um that darkness is that maybe the reason why the color on the jacket stood out? >> Well, the jacket didn't stand out until I was walking into the gas station behind her because I wasn't really like paying attention to what she had on. I just kept seeing her get in out of the truck, going in the gas station and coming back to the truck and that's what caught my attention. >> Okay. So, the movement is what what attracted you to it at first? >> Yes. >> Okay. >> Okay. testify watches that come out of the witness. Okay. >> Oh, I know that. I mean, after watching it, I can tell that was very hard for her. She has more emotion than the actual leader legal guardian of Naziah, the grandmother, Annette Harris, than Shannon Harris, Naziah's aunt. She don't even for sure see Nia's face and she has more emotion about what may have happened to Nziah and what has happened to these other kids than those two women that were directly in Niah's life. And you know what's crazy is you have the grandmother that didn't even say, "Hey, I haven't seen my granddaughter since 3:05 p.m. or she's supposed to come home by 3:05 p.m. But hm, let me sleep on it and and and tell the school in the morning, not call 911, just sleep peacefully in the night and then you you go to the school and then let them report it." Then you get that sorry ass retiring police officer Derek Wolf that's like I mean I didn't write down the names of who I talked to and uh I you know I was about to retire I was checked out some failures failures to Naziah Harris and this is the most per uh somebody up here that I've seen that cared the most so far out of this and didn't even really didn't know the girl she just knew she wasn't one of um Jarvis's kids. That's crazy. Okay, we're stopping here. We will fit we will pick back up with who whoever this witness is right here. Um, next time next time we go live, we'll pick up with her. I say that because I haven't seen it, so I'm sorry. I I'll know when it's time. But um, wow. I did not expect that detective to smirk and do his little shoulder shrug. Like, I mean, I was retired. I gave it to somebody else. I I asked a couple students. I don't know. I didn't put it in my notes. It is what it is. I did not expect him to have that attitude. By the time that trial comes back up, February, he might be answering a little bit differently. He may be cuz he probably has already gotten eaten up on the internet cuz I'm late to this. He might he might have a little bit different demeanor of how he answer those questions. I don't know. But I can't I cannot believe it. Wow. Wow. Wow. So, right now in my mind, these are just my personal opinions. Tlesia Moore, who only saw Naziah that day she went missing. She just happened to be the person that came into contact with Naziah. Um, she was able to identify that that was who was at her house. And I think the tether on Cordell Wright led them partially at least led them to her house because they were fixing her mother's car. But other than that, I don't think she has really further involvement except, you know, she didn't say, "Oh, she the little girl looked like she was pregnant." Or, "Oh, the little girl like she was in distress." She didn't see any of those things. So, you know, she just happened to be the house that they were at. Um, Tana's going through it. Jarvis's sister, the forensic tech sounds like she did her normal procedures for processing a scene. F. Derek Wolf and his Oh, Lord. Y'all better check his work at that court cuz he retired but now he works at the county clerk clerk's office or something like that. check behind his work because ain't no way cuz see he already getting his little retirement income too. He cruising. Check his work cuz other people still got to get their stuff through the court system. Yeah, those are my thoughts right now. Um, let me see what y'all said before I go cuz I forgot I had my thing filtered. Hold on. Let me see. [sighs and gasps] Lord. Okay, let me see. He used her car and she didn't give a damn. Whose car does she Whose car did he use? Right. Then try and leave the school after she tells the school. Right. Right. Put my kicks up. Right. Whose car did Jarvis use? This is a crazy case. The judge is the What is that? And see, you know what? I ain't going to say what sucks, but she only could rule if it could go to trial. I think it's going to have Is it going to have a different judge from her once now that it is actually going to trial? Cuz she was there to rule. They had they had enough to proceed to trial. He Oh, I haven't seen the wife yet cuz I forgot he's not with Shannon. He has a wife. I haven't seen the wife yet. Not only did her family fail her, but the system the system definitely failed her as well. The system failed that other little girl that was at whatever birthday party that uh the other family members reported to CPS. Yeah, the kids have been failed by the system as well, for sure. The lady on the screen is one of his baby mamas whose car he Oh, okay. Okay. Well, we will be picking back up with her next time um we do this a segment of this. We'll be picking back up with her. Okay. All right, y'all. Well, thank you for hanging in there with me and I will probably see y'all tomorrow. Just I don't know. Well, yeah, cuz even if I do small chunks, we can still kind of work our way through this. So, I'll probably see y'all tomorrow for body cam and we'll be watching more of this trial uh if at all possible. But thank you for hanging in there with me, for sharing your thoughts and opinions. I appreciate it. All right, talk to you later.