Okay, mic check. Mic check. And we have here Okay, trying to get back on schedule. So this is Tennessee versus Latasha Daniels. Um oh and I will be talking. We're not watching it straight through with me not talking, but I don't have to say as much as I do on body cams, but please if you're here, just know I'm talking. Um but Tennessee versus Latasha Daniels she uh fell in love with a married pastor. She believed he loved her. Um she went from she drove from Arkansas where they I think they all used to live, but then he moved to Tennessee cuz he was uh new pastor at a church in Tennessee. And she drove from Arkansas to Tennessee to confront him and she shot him and shot shot and killed him, but shot his wife cuz his wife had kind of like tried to protect him with her body. The wife supposedly did not know the pastor wanted to be in a polyamorous relationship. And I say supposedly just because, you know, but right now I believe her she didn't know that he was trying to do all this. Um and this happened the the murder happened in 2019. The trial happened November 5th uh November 4th 2025 and we're on day two November 5th 2025. We're finishing up hopefully finishing up day two. So, here we go. >> I'm seated. Welcome back. I state you may call your next witness. We're going to call Ray Paladino. >> My way, sir. Come this way. Come my way for me, sir. You'll stand here. >> Yes, sir. >> Face the jury, raise your right hand. Do you swear to affirm to tell the whole truth? >> I do. >> All right, you may have a seat, sir. Good afternoon. >> Good afternoon. >> Would you state your name and spell it for the court? >> Sure. Raymond, R A Y M O N D, last name Paladino, P A L A D I N O. >> Do you live in Memphis, Mr. Paladino? >> I do not. >> Where do you live? >> I live in Cabot, Arkansas. >> What is your occupation? >> I am the general manager of Fort Thompson Sporting Goods in Sherwood, Arkansas. >> And uh How far is Sherwood, Arkansas from Memphis, Tennessee? >> Depending on Interstate 40, roughly 2 and 1/2 hours. >> You drove it this morning? >> I did, yes, sir. >> Thanks for thanks for being here for us. Um Tell me about Fort Thompson Sporting Goods. What kind of store is that? >> Well, we are a We do a lot of hunting. We sell a lot of hunting stuff, firearms. We do um the shooting sports stuff. Um no fishing, but mainly just the hunting and stuff. [clears throat] >> So, hunting clothes, anything to do with hunting and stuff? >> You know you bet you. >> Okay. >> Firearms, ammo, you name it, everything. >> Uh Tell me a little bit about kind of the process you have to do to keep records when you sell a firearm to someone. >> So, when you sell a firearm, you do a background check. It's called a 4473. That's just a number they give it. Um we have to keep those sheets in our possession as long as we have that FFL number, which means your federal firearms license number. So, we have thousands of those. >> So, someone would have to provide you some suitable form of identification before they could purchase uh a firearm from you. >> Correct. It has to be a state-issued photo ID. >> Uh do you recall being contacted by Detective Chris Roberts from the Collierville Police Department sometime early April of 2019? >> I do. Yes, sir. >> what what was he asking you about that? >> Uh he was asking what when she came in, the firearm she had purchased, did we have video in the store, which we did and we do. And uh if he could have copies of that and come pick it up from us. >> And so, I think you already answered my question. You do have video in the store. >> Oh, yes. Yes, sir. >> Were you able to locate the sale that he was inquiring about? >> Yes, sir. >> Uh did you provide him a receipt >> Yes, sir. >> that was from that purchase? Did you provide him the video of the individual who purchased the firearm that he was inquiring about? >> We did. Yes, sir. >> All right. Just background in case someone's joining in the middle and they haven't been following along with us. Latasha, who is the defendant on this trial, bought a gun the same day she drove from Arkansas to Tennessee and shot and killed the pastor she was having an affair with. Um and so, they have the GM of that store in there asking, you know, what do you need to actually purchase a firearm legally? And then, also, did he have video, which if you were if you watched um the earlier one with us, we did watch along and we did see the surveillance video of Latasha purchasing the gun. Plus, they have a a a receipt. She had to use her own state ID, so it was very obvious that um she had purchased the gun. And I believe the defense is trying to say she planned on only killing herself, and she didn't plan on trying to kill anybody else, but that's where we are. That's the context. >> Let me uh Can you This has previously been marked as Exhibit 7. I just want to ask you if if that is the receipt that you in fact gave to uh Detective Roberts. >> And that is it. >> And so, that receipt shows a lot of things, doesn't it? >> Correct. Yes, sir. >> It shows the individual who purchased it. >> Correct. >> It shows the date and time they purchased it. >> It does. >> Which was what? >> That was 4:04:19. The time was 4:37 p.m. >> And it shows who purchased it. >> Correct. >> What was the name of the individual who purchased it? >> Uh Latasha Daniels. >> And does it also show anything specific about that handgun? >> Well, they have They'll tell you the model and the serial number on all our receipts. >> Tell me about a serial number. Uh what what is that? >> So, every firearm has a serial number, and there is never supposed to be a duplicate. So, if it says a number, it's that firearm, and it can be traced forever. >> I'm going to hand you what's also been previously marked as an exhibit and ask you >> So look in that box and identify that. >> That is a Ruger EC9S 9 mm. >> Can you tell me with both the receipt and the and the firearm in your hand if that is the firearm that was sold by that receipt? >> I can. You turn it over here. So you don't ever point a firearm >> [laughter] >> There it is, your return. I put them two in one night. This is it. Yes, sir. >> So you can confirm based on that information that Latasha Daniels purchased that firearm on April the 4th of 2019 at 4:37 p.m. from your store in Sherwood, Arkansas. >> Correct, 100%. >> Uh one more thing I want you to look at when Detective Roberts initially contacted you, did you take some still shots from your store video surveillance system? >> Correct. Our IT gentleman did state >> And is that one of the uh still shots that you provided to Detective Roberts? >> Yes, sir, it is. >> And what you're looking at Never I They It's already been published um but that did come from your store at that time? >> 100%. Yes, sir. >> That's all the questions I have. >> Yes, sir. >> Good afternoon, Mr. Paladino. >> Good afternoon. >> Had to make sure. >> Yes. >> Um I just have a couple questions for you, okay? This 4473 you talked about, can you tell me a little bit more about what that is? >> So what it is is the background check. First of all, you have to have a state picture ID issued. You fill out the background check. We run it through It's called a NYX system. All right? Which is a national tracing center background check. And you get proceeded, or you may get delayed, or you may get denied, or what have you. And if you're proceeded, that means you are legally to buy a firearm in our state of Arkansas. >> And that means no felony convictions, no domestic violence convictions, things like that. >> Correct. There's a number of questions on that sheet that you have to answer yes or no to, and it's it's very well detailed. >> Now, with it being very well detailed and having to go through this process, how long does that process normally take in store? >> So, it normally takes the customer roughly 7, 8, sometimes a little longer to fill out the sheet. Um we immediately sit down computer and put in the database. Now, a lot of times you'll see common last names, Smith, Brown, Johnson. You know, it may take a little longer for that to clear because there's a lot of them. So, um but there's some that come back instant. Some may take 10, 15, 20. I've seen it take a hour, hour and a half to come back. >> And you didn't actually help Ms. Daniels in the store that day, right? >> I I did not. >> So, you don't know how long her background check took. >> I don't. >> But based on what you saw in the video, you see that she got proceeded. >> Yes, 100% yes, ma'am. >> Uh which means she provided your store a state-issued ID. And she passed the background check. >> Yes, ma'am. >> So, she was authorized to purchase a firearm. >> Correct. >> Okay. Just playing guessing game here. So, um I feel like the defense make Possibly when it gets to the closing arguments, I'm not sure when they'll do it, but I feel like they're going to say Latasha was trying to take herself out. She wasn't trying to hide it, which is why she was fine with providing her real ID. And then also, she doesn't have violent tendencies or violent history. Um and so that's why she was approved to get the gun in the first place. I feel like that's the angle they're going to go eventually. And this trial again only lasted I think 4 days. >> Now, I want to talk to you about your store for just a second, okay? Um you have a wide variety of firearms. >> We do, yes, ma'am. >> You have handguns? >> We do. >> You have long guns? >> We do. >> Um I mean everything from a teeny tiny little the little itty-bitty guns that you see >> Yes. >> all the way up to the rifles. >> Yes, you bet, yes, ma'am. >> And is it fair to say that guns vary widely in size? >> Yes, they do. >> Is it fair to say that guns vary widely in weight? >> Correct. >> Is it fair to say that guns vary widely in price? >> Yes, yes, ma'am. >> Um guns can be really expensive. >> They can get very expensive. >> Um what do you think is the most expensive gun that you have in the store? >> Probably now, roughly, and I could be off, but I we have a Beretta shotgun in there that's around $6,000. >> Well, what what do you think is the least expensive gun that you have in there? >> We have probably a .22 revolver that ranges in the >> close >> to >> upper >> upper upper ones. >> Okay. And the .22, that's going to be typically less expensive than a 9 mm. >> Correct. In most cases, yes, ma'am. Not all, but most. >> 9 mm, what do they usually start around? >> Um roughly mid twos, and you can go up to four or five thousand dollars depending on if it's a custom. >> And when you have them displayed in your store, um do you have them up on the wall or do you have them in a case? >> They're on the wall. >> Okay, and so you have the gun itself and the price. >> Correct, yes ma'am. >> So when you're shopping if you said I want a gun this much money you would pick that out on the wall. >> Yeah, I I ask what are you looking for and what kind of price range and then we can go from there. >> Do you recall having that gun in stock? Do you have still have it in stock? >> Uh that one we I think we still have some. It's the models kind of switched up over the years but yeah. >> Do you recall having a purple version of that? >> We have had a purple, yes. >> And the purple version was more expensive than that one, right? >> It maybe was somewhat, yes. >> Uh now the receipt, I want to talk to you about that quickly. I think you still got it up there. The time you indicated was at 4:37 p.m. >> Correct. >> And all of the information that you have on that receipt matches Ms. Daniels, right? She didn't give a false ID or anything like Uh And that's 4:37 p.m. Central time. >> Central Standard Time, yes. >> And it took you about 2 and 1/2 hours to get down to 201 Poplar today. >> Roughly, yes ma'am. >> Okay. Uh about that particular gun if you would mind opening it up for me. Well, we talked about the fact that guns vary significantly in size and weight. >> Correct. >> If you wouldn't mind just picking that one up. >> Mhm. >> That is a smaller handgun, right? >> Correct. >> It is a lighter handgun. >> Correct. >> That's all I have, Your Honor. >> Do you have any >> No, ma'am. >> I just wanted to say >> Yes, ma'am. >> I'm wondering why that's important to defense. I hope we get answers. We shall see. All right, so they're going on a lunch break. Oh, that's a long lunch break. God, oh yeah, we about to be done fast with day two then cuz >> So, we're at the end, it's a state witness next, and then that's that's might be it because the lunch took up a chunk of this day. All right, so here we go. >> All right. What is your state? >> [clears throat] >> Good afternoon. >> Good afternoon. >> Will you state your name and spell it for the court reporter and the jury, please? >> Dr. Erica Curry, E R I C A C U R R Y. >> And Dr. Curry, are you a licensed medical doctor? >> I am. >> And what state? >> Uh Tennessee, um Arkansas, um New Mexico, Texas, um Illinois previously, um and those are the ones I can think of right now. >> And how long have you been a medical doctor? >> Uh for going on 14 years. Well, in forensic pathology, I graduated medical school in 2025, uh sorry, 2005, and then technically I was a medical doctor then, so if you want to say 20 years, but in forensic pathology, 14 >> And then was Do you specialize in any particular field of medicine? >> Yes, so um I My first specialization was in pathology, which is commonly known as uh the study of disease, so we're probably commonly known as the doctors that if you go get something taken out during surgery or biopsy, and they say they send it to the lab for the doctor to look at, um that's us as pathologists. So, after receiving uh specialization and board certification in uh pathology, and then I received certification for forensic pathology, which is basically doing autopsies to determine the cause of death, meaning uh why somebody died and the manner of death, which we have five categories of. >> And approximately how many autopsies have you done during your career? >> Uh about greater than 2,200. >> Have you testified as an expert in courts in Tennessee prior to this? >> Yes. >> Other states as well? >> Uh no, just primarily >> Just just primarily. So, do you know how many times approximately? >> Uh greater than 50. >> Your honor, state moves that Dr. Curry be declared an expert in the field of forensic pathology. >> No objection, your >> All right. We declare Dr. Curry an expert in the field of forensic pathology. >> On uh April 5th of uh 2019, where were you employed? >> At the West Tennessee Regional Forensic Center, also known as the Shelby County Medical Examiner's Office. >> And did you perform an autopsy that day on an individual named Brodus Perry? >> Yes. >> Um can you explain to the jury what an autopsy is, kind of what's involved, and what the purpose of an autopsy is? >> So, if um someone is deemed what's called under medical examiner jurisdiction, uh which is classified as unexpected or violent death, they are brought into the medical examiner's office for uh an examination. Uh and then whether an uh just inspection of the body or complete autopsy is determined whether either one of those is needed. Um when they come in, they're given a unique identifying number, which is the year, and we start from one all the way to the last day of the year uh at whatever that number is. Uh then um we uh examine uh the deceased person. Uh we examine the outside of the body. We take whatever necessary evidence there is, clothing, fingernail clippings, um hair. Uh then we um do uh x-rays if needed, especially in the case of uh homicide. Um and then we document everything we see on the outside of the body, the hair color, the eye color, the weight, the length, any scars, any tattoos, and certainly any injuries. And we document those often on what's called a body diagram, which is just a representation of the human body. Uh so then after we do that, then we examine everything on the inside of the body to document any injuries and look at all the organs and document any injuries we see on the organs and the weight of any natural disease we see on the organs. During that process, we actually take blood and other samples to send off to the toxicology lab to test for substances that were in the body at the time the person died. So then after we make those notes, and then we put together a report documenting everything we found. >> And did you give the autopsy that you performed on Brutus Perry a number? >> Yes. >> And what number was that? >> It's 2019-0582. >> And did you you took photos? I guess you said you you would take photos in this particular autopsy, did you take photos? >> Uh photos were taken by the autopsy assistant that helped me or technician that helped me. >> Can you um describe to the jury the injuries that you if any that you found when you performed this autopsy on Mr. Perry? >> Yes, I'm going to refer to my notes. So, Mr. Perry had a gunshot wound of the head. It entered on the right side of the head. It fractured a bone close by where it entered, and then it also fractured the bone of his right eye. And then I also caused some injuries to the brain. And then it traveled into the mouth where it injured the tongue. And then the bullet went through the left side of his jaw and injured the jawbone. And then the bullet lodged on the left side of his jaw and then created a wound right under or right above where it lodged, which was what I turned a partial exit wound, meaning the bullet didn't go completely out. And then he had three gunshot wounds of his abdomen on the right upper portion. Those went into his abdomen or stomach cavity, injured his intestines and his liver. And then it also um injured his right adrenal gland, which is a organ endocrine organ that sits above the kidney. And then it completely um made his right kidney go into two halves. So, those are the injuries that happened on the abdomen. And then there were three bullets recovered associated with those gunshot wounds. One in the spine, one from the back and one from his left hip. And then he had a gunshot wound that was on his right buttock. And then it went into the soft tissue and most of the right buttock causing hemorrhage. And then it traveled into his right side of his lower back where a bullet was recovered from there. And then he had a graze wound, just meaning the bullet went past the skin and didn't go into the body. He had one of those on his right upper arm and then one on the front of his left wrist. >> Can I hand you a picture and ask you if you can identify it? That, please. >> Yes, I can. >> And is that a photo you took of one of the wounds you just described to the jury? >> It was a photo taken at the time of autopsy not by me but by the uh autopsy technician but yes, of the wound of the head. >> And does that accurately depict what you observed while taking that autopsy while performing that autopsy? >> Yes. >> Judge, I'd like to ask that >> No objection. We'll show 8315 and it's a photo of a wound of the head. >> And may I publish that for the jury, please? >> Yes. >> So what were we looking at there? You described that as if I understood your testimony correctly, that was the entrance wound that went all the way across down through his jaw and almost came out the other side. Is that correct? >> That's correct. >> So let me hand you another picture and ask you if you can identify that. >> Yes, this is um a picture of the deceased's face and you can see that um wound on the left side of his jaw where the bullet almost came out but the bullet's actually underneath it. >> Can I make that next exhibit, please, your honor? >> No objection to that. We'll show 8316 and it's a photo of the wound on the left side of the jaw. >> And may I publish that here? >> Yes. >> And so that's the photograph you just identified, is that correct? >> That's correct. >> And again, you you described it as as a partial exit wound, meaning the the bullet is still there, but the injury that we see is where the bullet almost exited the body, is that correct? >> And you >> Yes, this is the a picture of the entrance gunshot wound that was on the right buttock. >> Judge, I would ask that be marked next in order, please. >> No objection. I'm going to mark exhibit 17 as the entrance of the wound to the right buttock. >> And if I may publish that. >> Yes. >> And so is this the picture that you just identified, is that correct? >> Yes. >> And that entered stayed in the body and you recovered uh that bullet from while performing the autopsy. >> That's correct. >> And you Can you identify that photo? >> Yes, this is a picture of the deceased right arm and kind of the right side of his chest and abdomen. Um it's picturing the graze wound or the wound where the bullet went by the skin and didn't actually go in of his right upper arm and you can also see two of the gunshot wounds that are on his abdomen. >> And may I publish that I want to make that the next exhibit, please? >> No objection. On March 16th, 18 is a photo of wounds to the right arm and right part of his chest. >> And may I publish that, your honor? >> Yes. >> And I think, Dr. Curry, when when that print it cut off actually a little bit of that. Is this the the photo that you just identified? >> With one extra wound. >> Yeah. So, the the three that we see, the four, two, and the one below the two, are those the the three wounds that you talked about, the three bullets that went into the abdomen? >> Yes, should be numbered two, three, and four. >> Okay. And then six is one of the two graze wounds that you testified about. >> That's correct. >> So, you recovered the the bullet from the head, you recovered those three from the abdomen. >> Yes. >> And you recovered the one from the back from the back. >> Butt, yes. Yeah, yeah, the the bullet from it came from the back, but it's corresponding to the bullet that entered on the right buttock. >> And I have one more photo, which is the uh Well, I'll let you tell us what it is. >> Uh yes, it's a picture of the graze wound that was on the front of his um his left wrist, yes. >> Um I'd like to make that the next exhibit your honor. >> No objection. >> Show it. 8019 is the gray one on the left wrist. >> All right. Right. And may I publish that for the jury? >> Yes. >> And Dr. Curry, is this the photo that you just identified? >> Yes. >> And tell us what happens when you um recover evidence or in this case particularly bullets while performing the autopsy? >> So um they're packaged in a sealed evidence envelope. Um I initial and date them and then um they're put together with other evidence that we take at the time of autopsy, clothing, uh fingernail clippings, uh hair, um and any of the other evidence we take. And then they're um logged and then placed into our uh the evidence room at the West Tennessee Regional Forensic Center and eventually picked up by the investigating police agency. >> And you and you'll have to to open this. This is still sealed. I'm going to ask you if you can open that and identify the the contents of that bag. >> Mhm. >> That these are the um bullets that were recovered from uh the deceased at the time of the autopsy and the uh field evidence envelopes uh still with uh seal tag, the date, and my initials. >> All right. And there's five total of these? >> Yes. >> So, did you want to have that those five be made collectively an exhibit the bullets recovered during the autopsy? >> Your Honor, I believe these have all been already marked as exhibit six. >> Oh, that's I mean that may be true. >> They are. >> Okay, I think I've seen Okay, all right, perfect. Thank you. >> All right. Now, does anyone know off the top of their head how many bullets a Ruger can hold because it look looks like he she shot him five times. Don't know if she missed any, too, by the way. I I don't know that yet. Um but she shot him five times. I know she shot the wife at least one time and the wife said she did hear Latasha like re- trying to reload the gun at one point. So, I'm about to Google it though just so I can see. Um But Darlene said, "This must be torture listening to how many times she shot." The torture for who though? Cuz she know what she did. So, I don't know. But I guess you still don't want to be held accountable. But you know she know what she did. >> But of those wounds um were any of them or all of them fatal on their own or was it a combination or can you testify to that? >> So, um the ones in the head and the abdomen certainly were very significant wounds in my opinion that would have led directly to death. The one in the uh the the right abdomen because it mostly just caused hemorrhage where the track it went through wouldn't have been uh fatal in my >> And so based on uh your expertise and your examination during that autopsy, were you able to form an expert opinion concerning the cause of Ms. Brooks' death? >> Yes. >> And what was that? >> Uh multiple gunshot wounds. >> And >> Yeah, I would I would bet it was multiple gunshot wounds. Okay, so it says it can hold between 10 to 15 rounds. So she must have missed sometimes too then, which [snorts] I I'm sure just like we saw in the some other trials they'll possib- whoever took the pictures in the actual crime scene, maybe they'll end up showing the bullets that hit the walls and hit the other stuff. >> [snorts] >> Uh yeah, Darlene, she the forensic pathologist on the stand, she does seem happy to testify. She said she's already done this over 50 times. She's the first one that hasn't looked nervous on the stand. The pastor's wife looked nervous on the stand. Um all the officers they called looked nervous on the stand, but um you know, they they said they didn't use lethal force and I mean Latasha's still here to actually face trial. Um the GM for that sporting goods store where they sold her the gun, he didn't seem nervous either, but everybody else has seemed nervous so far except for her and him. >> The manner of death? >> Uh homicide, which for forensic uh terms means uh death at the hands of another. >> That's all the questions I have for this >> Cross examination >> Thank you, Your Honor. Stephanie McGarry, good afternoon. Don't have many questions for you, but I have a couple, okay? >> Okay. >> Um first, just kind of going from what you just said, homicide. In your profession I'm never saying this word. That is an epidemiological assessment, right? What does that mean? >> Mean for once we fill the death certificate and it has the cause and manner of death, it is analyzed in this state by the state of Tennessee by the statistics in order to I guess run the numbers of the different categories of death. >> So a category of death could be homicide. >> Yes. >> Could be suicide. >> That's correct. >> Could be natural. >> That's correct. >> Are there any others? >> Yes. It is natural, then accident, and then could not be determined or undetermined. >> Okay. So >> That defense better not claim it was an accident. You don't accidentally shoot somebody five times. And she again, I think she shot more, but that's the five she actually hit him with. But I can't wait to see this defense's closing arguments or whatever because I I don't know what their thing is. I know again, I will say in their opening statements, it seemed like they um are claiming she was suicidal. She meant to use the gun on herself. Implied to use the gun on herself. Um she was heartbroken. Maybe they're going to say she wasn't in her right mind, but she didn't plan on actually shooting him with it. But again, she bought the weapon the same day. She lives in Tennessee according to what how much I've heard. She don't have time to think from driving from Tennessee to Arkansas to go to the apartment of the pastor and his wife. Pastor went home in first. Wife is home, lets her in cuz she knows her from the previous church or whatever. And she said, "Oh, I'll wait for the pastor to come back." Pastor comes back. The wife said he looked a little agitated cuz of course he didn't expect to see LaTasha there, I'm sure. And he tried to offer the wife and LaTasha some alcohol. And then, you know, at some point LaTasha gets to shooting. Don't tell me the defense is going to try to claim accidental you drove from a from one state to another state the same day you bought a gun. I don't I don't want to hear that. But, um yes, Simone Oh, wait, anger management? I don't know if it's Okay, so Simone said, "Is this the trial where the anger management therapist took out her married lover?" I don't think she's an anger management therapist. This one's just a She got caught up or she caught herself up in a triangle because, again, her own defense attorney was saying that um he was really rude to her. She could only show up in a hotel um to meet him naked. If she got clothes on, he don't want anything to do with her. So, I'm like, I don't know where the love part came in when that's how it's already starting off. Then, he didn't pay for any of the trips cuz he had church trips. He didn't pay for any of the trips for her. She had to pay her own way. Plus, I I really feel like he borrowed money from her before. I'm not sure about that part yet. Don't know where I got that from, but I feel like I heard something that said, "Oh, man, he's using these women for uh money, too." But, he also had a little group chat because he believes in ethical non-monogamy or believed cuz he ain't here no more believed in ethical non-monogamy I'mma say polyamorous relationship. His wife said she he one time tried to give her a book, but she didn't pay it any mind cuz she couldn't remember the title and all this other stuff. And this did take place over 5 years ago, so she really might not have remembered the book. But, according to her, she was never good with being in a polyamorous relationship, but he told his little group chat um What was that thing called? I'mma look for the name and I'll tell y'all later, but uh he had a group chat like three other Well, three women including Latasha. Because, on day one, I they showed him in his little group chat doing his little podcast bro thing, talking about stuff, and how supposedly his wife was like, "Just don't have anybody in the same city as us." And then, she was sending him to a woman sometimes, something like that. But, that was that was his thing on the um the videos that were left over from his group chat from that time frame. Uh so I haven't heard them say her occupation of being an anger management person, so I don't think I don't know if this is her or not based off of that part, Simone. >> When you determine that something is a homicide, that is not an indication of criminal intent, right? >> Not from uh forensic pathologist standpoint, that's correct. >> So when you say homi- a homicide, you do not that does not equal premeditated murder. >> No. >> Uh that equals more than one person was involved. >> That equals for us that the death occurred at the hands of another person. >> Okay. So nothing about your assessment gives any assessment to Ms. Daniels' mindset. >> That's correct. >> Okay. I want to talk to you about each of the individual shots briefly, okay? And you have your report there. You have them labeled A B C D E. >> That's correct. >> And you also have no numerical designation. >> That's correct. >> For each for A, do you have an A1? Is that kind of how that works that you >> So the um numerical uh is for picture taking purposes and to be able to refer to them in the report. And and then the alphabetical is just um the way I note take the report is just describe from the top of the head to the bottom of the feet. So it's just a ordering uh system. >> And the um the numbers and letters that you assign to it don't have any bearing on the order in which those injuries occurred. >> That's correct. >> So on gunshot wound A, that was the gunshot wound to the head? >> That's correct. >> And >> Sorry, my other angle I feel like the fence may go with is self-defense. Cuz she was like, "You don't know which order the gunshots occurred." So, I wonder if the defense is going to say he charged at her and she was shooting to defend herself. That's another theory, um another guess. I can't wait to see what they say, if they even tie it together cuz the opening statements threw me for a loop. Ladonna says they tell the side chick anything and they believe it, but I don't believe he said that to her. And I'm wondering if you mean um I cuz I don't believe he told her he loved her either. I don't believe it. I think he's he's already been pretty open with the with the women that's in the group chat. And then after he was on for the group chat was named Marco Polo. And his wife on the stand said she would ask him, "Oh, that the wife is down with it." Yeah, okay. Well, well, Ladonna, when he was on that Marco Polo app, he was saying to his three women, including her, that his wife was down for it. Not This is not her doing hearsay. That's what he was saying in those group chat videos that we actually got to see in court. So, if he said it there already to them, he might also say it later, but he definitely said at one point his wife was okay with it. And she just set the rules so they could, you know, he could make sure, you know, it happens within her boundaries and all this stuff. Um so, he told he broke up with Latasha through a app called Confide. And um but he would do this Marco Polo app to talk with his his his uh his harem of the three women. And um she would she knew about the Marco Polo app, but he told her it was a book club. So, there's that as well. >> One would be the entrance wound. >> That's correct. >> And two would be the exit wound. >> Well, in this case, five was the the exit wound on this one because the um because of just the way the ordering went with this one. >> And so the entrance wound was about here, right? >> Yes. >> And the exit wound was about here. >> Well, yeah, where the bullet almost went out. So, call it a partial, but yes. >> So, when you have these two points, >> Mhm. >> you're able to determine a trajectory. >> That's correct. >> What is a trajectory? >> So, just the way the bullet traverses um in inside or on the body once it enters and then through and exits. So. >> The trajectory when you make your trajectory assessments, you base it on anatomical position, right? >> Yes. >> What does that mean? >> So, just basically it is we do this just to standardize the way we notate injuries. Basically, it's the representation of the human body with someone standing with their palms facing up. So, standard facing you with their >> So, >> Yes. >> like this. >> Yes. >> This would be the anatomical position. In reality, when things are actually happening, this is very rarely the position in which people were, right? >> We like I said do that to standardize, but we do realize that when people are injured that that's not all the way all the time the way they are positioned. So, yes. >> And the trajectory of the bullet is determined by position of the decedent's body and the position of the person with the gun, right? >> Yes. >> So, if I'm shooting you right here, you're not and and you're looking at me just like this, you would have a gunshot wound right here and it would go pretty straight through your back, right? >> Yes. >> Whereas if I'm standing on your side, same thing, right? >> Yes. >> And if you lean over, that's going to change. >> That's correct. >> If you lean over or back, it's going to give an upward or downward deviation. >> Can, yes. >> Okay. So, when we look at gunshot wound A, you noted a a trajectory on that of being right to left. >> Yes. >> And that's indicating his right side to his left side. >> That's correct. >> Downward. >> Yes. >> So, that and slightly back to front. >> Correct. >> Um so, you you cannot say that he was standing here like this when that kind of angle is involved, right? >> That's correct. >> Would that kind of angle be consistent with someone falling? >> Um the if their head was going downward and the bullet was traversing downward, that in my opinion would be consistent with with that. >> this angle and they're falling, >> it'd be good Well, I would have You have to see the position [clears throat] of the gun cuz I I I'm not certain on the position of the gun. So, uh >> Can can that kind of downward angle be created by someone falling? Is can that be consistent? >> Ooh, where are you going, defense? Okay, so Teresa said I used to want to be a forensics pathologist with my scary tail. That had to be a false dream. I don't know how they can do it. I don't know how they can do it either. Simone said she did look it up. Latasha Daniels was a mental health professional from Little Rock, Arkansas. Um she said I agree with you. She had ample time to make an alternative decision, seek emergency therapy, etc. And she said she had the knowledge and tools to know how to seek help. Yeah, she she had the tools. She ain't use them then, but she did have the tools. And Teresa said therapy doesn't always help. Let me tell you what, Teresa. Therapy don't always help. Possibly. Possibly. You got to sometimes you got to find your right fit in everything, too. But, here's the other thing. When she was getting out of I what she says was an abusive cheating relationship from her husband, Latasha when I say her, from her husband, she went to the church next. I didn't hear the defense mention therapy. Maybe they did. I forgot if they did. So, it doesn't sound like therapy was in her she was using therapy in her toolbox that she could have used. She went to the and the pastor she went to was this pastor that's no longer with us. Um He probably took advantage of her. You know how you go through some a trauma and you then you sometimes you you get really hard in church. He possibly took advantage of that. But, this is the other thing. I'mma keep I'mma keep bringing this up every time I remember. The defense tried to frame it as um Oh my god, what they call them? It was like a life leader or a light leader or something. In that church that the the pastor was when he was in Arkansas, they had these things called like light coaches or life leaders, something like that. Latasha [clears throat] became one. But, the defense tried to frame it as out of the thousands or the hundreds of people in this church, um Latasha was one of the 20 chosen to be blah blah blah. And I'm standing by, no, she put herself out there because I guarantee you not 100% of a congregation wants to be one of those leaders. So, it's going to be the ones that show interest and then you can you might get picked out of that pool if they even have a pool or if it's just like thank god somebody else wants to do this or we'll take them them as a volunteer as well. So, there's a bit of there he's a predatory pastor. He's already been doing this. He's true to this. And then his little friend, Pastor Pointer, is his cover-up. Let me bring this up, too, in case y'all haven't been watching the other days. He told Latasha, the pastor told Latasha, "If I'm dying, call uh Pointer. Don't call emergency services. So, that right there should have told her his wife is probably not going to be good with this because why can't she seek emergency help for him if it's an open relationship? Everybody's cool. Why would you tell me I got to call your buddy instead of calling who could save your life if you have those kind of things? So, for Latasha, that should have clicked. And again, I say he's still predatory. He is. Um but I feel like she's she seems like she's a little long in the tooth to know some of these tactics, but they're saying she came damaged and it can happen, but it's Latasha and the pastor. I'm like, ah, I'm side-eyeing everybody on this one. >> It could be. >> It could also be consistent with having an upward angle. It just depends on how the body's positioned. >> Well, from the trajectory, it's traversing downward. So, once again, I would have to know where the gun was in in relation to the body. >> Did you say that? >> Yes, sir. >> Okay. And so, uh one of the things that you also looked at was soot, stippling, and muzzle imprint, right? >> And on every one of these gunshot wounds, there was no soot, stippling, or muzzle imprint. >> That's correct. >> So, let's take each of those individually. What is soot? >> So, soot is the black material that comes out of the end of the gun. >> Okay. And that is something that you can use to make a distance determination between the person and the muzzle of the gun, right? >> We can estimate, yes. >> Okay. And that's usually for soot about what? 4 ft? 4 or more? 4 ft? >> For >> For soot. >> For soot to to be around the wound, >> Yes. >> as you're asking, it would have to be a close-range gunshot wound, which means inches. Close or inches for soot to be around the wound. >> Okay. I'm sorry. I jumped ahead of you. That This is the 4-ft stippling. >> No. >> [laughter] >> Now, tell me which one is the 4-ft >> So, so if there's lack of soot and if there's lack of stippling, then from measurements and previous studies, then we can say that the gunshot wound is indeterminate or distant and we have to be sure with indeterminate that there was nothing blocking the soot from getting onto the body. And if we exclude that, then we say distant and that means that the from when the gun was fired to hitting the body, there was 3 ft or greater distance between. >> So, the the 3 ft or greater, that's the indeterminate. >> Yes. >> And that determination, 3, 4 ft, whatever, it also depends on what type of weapon is being used, right? >> So, if you have soot, stippling, muzzle imprint, you're within that 3 ft. >> Right. And to your to your point, the only way to know exactly is to actually test fire the gun with the ammunition that was used and we would know specifically, accurately what it would be. >> And the muzzle imprint, that would be an actual contact wound. >> That's correct. >> Um and none of those things were present here. >> That's correct. >> So, the indications by what you saw is that the muzzle of the gun was 3 ft or more away from Mr. Perry. >> That's correct. >> Um the two graze wounds that you indicated, I wanted to talk to you about those briefly, okay? Typically, particularly with the position of the graze wounds, those do not necessarily indicate separate shots, right? >> That's correct. >> Um especially that one on the right side, it is most likely a graze wound of one of the entrance or entrance >> I I can't say most likely, but it's a possibility that >> It's consistent with that. >> It could be from one of the entrances on the abdomen. >> Okay. And then on direct, you were discussing whether any of these on their own would have been fatal. >> Yes. >> And I'm trying to make sure I heard you correctly. You indicated that the head wound and one of the abdominal wounds, I thought you said could have been fatal on their own. >> So, the head wound and the abdominal wounds as cuz they were grouped together as a cluster because they commingled. All of those would have been fatal. The one on the buttock, in my opinion, would not have been fatal. >> Okay. And the one of the abdomen ones that was pretty shallow. >> Uh well, no, they all entered into the abdominal cavity. So. >> There were three in the abdomen, right? >> That's correct. >> I thought you indicated two of the ones I thought you said two of the abdominal shots could have been fatal, one of them no. >> No. All three could have been cuz they all entered into the abdominal cavity, all caused injuries that in the intestine and the liver and the kidney. So, they all three caused the injuries inside. >> Are all of those necessarily fatal? >> Um with So, because I couldn't tell this bullet hit this specific specifically, this bullet hit that one specifically, then I couldn't say that, you know, these two didn't, these two That's why they're grouped together because when they got inside the body, they >> Okay. I understand what you're saying a little bit better now. Thank you. Excuse me. Um >> Okay. Before she goes on, I just want to say cuz as I'm thinking about it, I want to try to uh say what I'm thinking. Another thing that her defense said in their opening statement was that LaTasha was telling him, "I'm going to tell your wife." And she said, the pastor said, "Tell her. She already knows. There's nothing to tell her. So, go ahead and tell her." type thing. And so, that's how she is how her defense is explaining why she went to the apartment. She went to the apartment, according to them, to tell the wife about him and him cheating. But again, why did you buy a gun the same day you just wanted to tell tell the wife that? Like, what? I don't believe that's what happened. I do believe maybe at some point she threatened to tell the wife, possibly. But she was waiting on him cuz when she got there, according to the wife's testimony, the wife said when she when she told LaTasha the pastor wasn't there, then she said, "Okay, I'll wait for him." But just so you know, the defense puts her in that apartment because she said, "I'm I'm going to tell your wife." And the pastor like, "Fine, tell her." Okay, let me see. Timo said, "Am I missing the point of this line of questioning? The wife wasn't a witness to the shooting. Is the defense trying to suggest a different shooter?" I don't think they're trying to suggest a different shooter. I think they're trying to prove a certain mindset. That's cuz they cuz it's no it's cuz she the police showed up to the apartment after she shot and killed the pastor and shot the wife. So, everybody's eyes already saw she was at the apartment. The cops said she didn't respond when they told her to put the gun down, but she also didn't like try to aim it anymore. So, I don't think anyone's trying to say that she wasn't there, including her defense. I think the defense is trying to prove some state of mind or this wasn't the original intention to shoot him, but it turned to that because something else set her off or she was scared cuz he was charging at her. I'm cuz when she started mentioning angles, I'm like, "Why do you care about the angle of the bullets? So and then she was like if your if your body's positioned this way and she said a bent over. So I feel like the defense is going to say he was bent over Latasha trying to intimidate her and Latasha shot him then cuz she was scared. She was afraid. We're going to see but I I'm telling you I don't know where the defense is going yet. I'm we all out here playing the guessing game. Um Ladonna said facts Teresa especially if they go in manipulating cuz the doctor only knows who you show up to be and folks are really slick. You can play a therapist. You can. I have to child I be trying to choose my therapist I can get past my own BS because I'm going to tell you what you want to hear because I that's my people pleaser in me. So I'm like oh yeah I worked on it didn't work on it. Did not work on this whatever homework you gave me I I probably didn't but I'm going to tell you well I'm going to tell I did do the homework but I'm going to tell you it turned out great but your advice really didn't but I don't want to tell them that their advice did not help me. That's what I do. So I'm yeah they have to watch out for some of us that are like we'd rather tell you what you want to hear than what we actually are going through. All right. >> A a wound to the kidney is not necessarily fatal, right? >> In this instance it is because it made the kidney go into two halves. So um that that now you do have another kid- kidney but the bleeding from that having one of your kidney being two halves is pretty devastating. >> And this is a question I have I don't know the answer to it. On these with these injuries would you know prompt and appropriate medical attention could that make it not fatal? Is it is it fatal just because of the injury or is it fatal untreated? How does >> So he did have medical attention and did have attempted surgery because there were some surgery inside of his intestine and they weren't able to revive him from that. >> But you were able to tell that they did try >> Yes. >> uh medical intervention. >> They definitely >> Which would indicate when he got to the hospital he was alive. >> Yes. >> Okay. uh And nothing about your assessment can go to uh intent or type of uh homicide, right? >> That's correct. >> That's all I have. >> I'm going back to hear that last question by the defense one more time. >> And nothing about your assessment can go to uh intent or type of uh homicide, right? >> That's correct. >> That's all I have. >> Okay, so the I think the defense is also going to go with she brought the gun for protection because I I remember something else. The defense said he was abusive to LaTasha. So, the defense is going to go with LaTasha just brought that for protection cuz she was going to confront his wife. She didn't go with I'm just going to kill him with that mindset. That's what they're going to say. I I'm thinking that's what they're going to say. And then uh since you pointed out that he he was still alive when he got to the hospital, I think she's going to say my client wasn't trying to kill him. She was just trying to defend herself or something like that. This We'll see. We only got two more days of this to see what the closing arguments are going to be. Well, two days in their time. It might be split up because of the time I have to watch the live, but yeah. That's what I'm I'm thinking. All right. Oh, if that's the last question, let me see if they have anything else. >> No question. >> Okay, yeah. That's it. That was day two we just finished. Um it was shorter because I thought we had a lot longer to watch but that was a whole lunch break in there. Just taking up time for no reason. So uh we should be watching the next part. I really hope this week I can fit in the start of day three. But we'll see. No promises. Um let me see. Let's see. Wack How said her defense is not saying she did not shoot him but they are putting her mental state out there to get away from the premeditated findings. I agree. They are trying to run away from anything with premeditated or thought out. This was all either she was going to use it on herself or she brought it for protection when she went to go tell his wife what he been up to. I'm with you on that one Wack How. Yeah. I'm with you. Okay. Um if you you're going to see clips later posted but it'll just be what we've already watched. I'm just piecing it out for people that more do the replay than the live stream. Um Simone, right. Exactly. She can call, message the wife, and meet somewhere else. Right. Cuz Simone, they play her and the wife would play tennis together. So she definitely already had direct access to the wife. That's not why you went to that person's apartment. Stop it. So yeah, I'm with you on that one Simone. Um Ladonna said it's not going to work. Why go there if you're in fear? Call. They trying though. They trying. And um the verdict's already out so I can I could tell y'all what what she was actually convicted of but if you want to know ahead of time go see it. I'm going to try not to I already spoiler alerted it once but I'm going to try to wait till we actually get there this time for the sentencing. But yeah, um the defense was I feel like they were going hard for this wasn't meant to be a homicide, you know? Mhm. All right. But yeah, I will see y'all again soon. Thank you for coming and watching this with me. I appreciate y'all chilling with me. Um yeah, Simone they played tennis together. Mhm. Mhm. Just all up under of woman's face. Mhm. All right, I will see y'all later. Bye.