one
good afternoon this is Daniel here with
cops and cons TV just want to welcome
everyone into our live show we're going
to break down some of the most important
interesting cases and news stories that
involve police officers and law uh we
missed last week so we've got a lot to
cover today there were so many
interesting and just really cool police
stories that we're going to get into and
talk about
um again just like always as we're going
through it make sure you put in the
comments if you think anything
differently than I do or you have a
different take on it or maybe you're in
a local jurisdiction where you have some
information that may be the general
public might not so definitely want to
thank everybody again for coming in and
make sure if you haven't already to like
And subscribe to the channel that way
you know exactly when we are coming live
on this show and this is our holiday
show so again thank everybody for being
in here I just want to say start off by
saying Merry Christmas and happy
Festivus all right so where's everybody
from today looks like we have someone
from Ohio we have a couple people in
from a couple different places we got
Florida Texas all right well I want to
welcome everyone in
um so is anyone in here from Kansas City
I know every now and then we get someone
in here from Kansas City because that's
where we're going with this first story
and you know I really like news stories
and police related stories that kind of
cross over into different sections of
life you know this is one of the reasons
why I've listened to out kick the
coverage in clay Travis for years
because not only does he talk about
sports but he also talks about news and
politics I think it's interesting when a
bunch of different genres of news all
kind of mix and that's where we're going
with this first story it's really
strange it's out of Kansas City Missouri
because that's where the Kansas City
Chiefs play so essentially what happened
is there is a guy and he dresses up all
crazy crazy in this like wolf outfit and
at every single chief game he's been
doing this for like seven years and he's
become somewhat of a local celebrity in
the Kansas City area uh he has over 35
000 followers on Twitter and really
everyone there in the community knows
him um he calls himself Chief zahala but
besides that no one really knew too much
about the guy he on his Instagram and
his Twitter account he puts in that he's
a warehouse manager and one of the
questions that a lot of people have had
over the years is it seems like at every
game he has these unbelievable really
close like 50-yard line seat so how does
he afford it and what he's told people
in the past is that he's you know he
makes good money being a warehouse
manager so that's how he makes his money
to pay for these unbelievable seats well
turns out that isn't the case so what
happened is the Kansas City Chiefs were
in Houston because he also goes to away
games the Kansas City Chiefs were in
Houston last weekend somehow chief
zahala he wasn't there so people started
to get concerned you know internet slew
and you know people who you know the
local community there in Kansas City
noticed he wasn't there and since he's
there in his crazy costume every game
for seven years they got concerned so
what they did is they called the Kansas
City Police Department to do a welfare
check well the Kansas City Police
Department did some investigation and
they found that there's actually a
pretty good reason why he wasn't at that
game because he was arrested for robbing
a bank apparently Chief zahala whose
real name is Xavier Buddha Bar
apparently what he would do is as he was
on his way to Chiefs games the ones that
were out of town he would rob a bank
along the way in order to pay for these
unbelievably expensive tickets and he
was arrested for robbing a bank and it's
been a big new story in the Kansas City
area and it's absolutely crazy yeah Rice
Crispy great name um but yeah yeah he
robbed the bank apparently he's been
robbing banks for quite a while one of
the other things he used to do so I
think this is actually going to go
deeper than just robbing the bank even
though that's a federal offense he's
going to go away for a long time for the
that but apparently he what he does with
that money also is he goes and he
launders that money so he fraudulently
with this stolen money he's been going
to charity auctions to the Kansas City
Chiefs charity auctions and buying all
this uh memorabilia from the Kansas City
Chiefs with this stolen money so uh
that's money laundering as well so this
guy's got a lot of problems but um yeah
the picture of him and then apparently
what he did to rob the bank and he wore
the same mask or a similar mask that he
wears at Chiefs games while he was
robbing a bank so it's really hard to
say exactly how long he's been doing
this for but it's absolutely crazy
Sergeant George says uh when showing
your loyalty to your favorite sports
team goes horribly awry yeah I know what
you mean Sergeant George I mean back in
my day what we used to do is people
would just paint their faces and paint
letters on their chest you know so this
is this is taking it to the extreme ohm
but we'll definitely keep following this
case to see what happens but it's an
absolutely wild case no one no one
thought that that was the case and again
this guy is like a local celebrity 35
followers on Twitter so um yeah that's
that that is that is an interesting one
uh Rich Spillman says crime does pay for
a while yeah I guess it pays and I guess
you get really good football seats with
it so um you know what I'm surprised is
how did it take this long for him to get
caught and again we don't know how long
he's been doing this but some of the
preliminary information is that he's
been doing this for quite a while so to
be able to go ahead and rob banks like
this with all the technology and
security that banks have in order to
catch these people it's really
interesting how he's been able to get
away from it for so long and this was in
rural rural Oklahoma so it's not like he
got caught in some big city where these
there's these like expansive teams of
police officers that are like staking
out banks no I mean it was a it was it
was a rural Oklahoma right over the
Texas border is where this occurred and
yeah he committed the robbery and police
were on scene in two minutes in a small
town so um that was great uh BLD nurse
12 says not in California yeah so if he
would have done this in California
instead of being arrested they probably
just would have felt bad for him and
given him Chiefs tickets for the next
seven years so
um yeah that's probably what would have
happened there uh yeah so that was an
interesting story and uh the next story
that we're going to talk about isn't as
much fun I'm just going to warn you
right now it's not as much fun but it's
really an important case because this
involves an officer-involved shooting
and then a police officer subsequently
being charged with a crime and he just
was sentenced and I'm going to kind of
go through all that and I've got some
pretty strong opinions on this case but
you know like with every case reasonable
people might disagree so definitely put
your comments definitely put your
comments um in the in the uh uh chat so
we can go back and forth here a little
bit so the case I want to talk about
it's officer Aaron Dean so so this was
an officer involved shooting in Fort
Worth Texas in 2019 and let me just set
this up a little bit so here's what
happened there's a woman the woman who
was killed by the police officer is
Atiana Jefferson at the time she was 28
years old so the way this starts from
the the perspective of the of the police
officers uh uh Willie weed what happened
did they finally charge the chump yeah
they did and we're going to go ahead and
talk about that Willie so what so this
case was there was a call for service so
a neighbor called in and here's what the
neighbor told dispatch that it was late
at night and that Miss Jefferson's house
that the door was open the neighbor said
this is weird it's strange it is a
suspicious thing for this door to be
just wide open and it was really late at
night like in the middle of the night
when this happened so that goes out to
police officers so that's what they were
dispatched to two different police
officers Officer Aaron Dean and his
partner officer Carol darts were
dispatched to that call for service so
they did a couple things thing so when
they got there they essentially verified
the information that was given by the
caller they got unseen and then they
parked a little bit of ways away and
they walked up which is appropriate to
do because as a police officer when you
go to a case like this you don't know if
it's just someone who left the door open
or if there's a burglary or a felony in
progress you really just don't know so
you have to look at the observations the
first observations you made and what the
police officer saw is they saw that the
door was wide open now this was 2 25 in
the morning so it's you have a neighbor
who says hey this is strange and then
you know it's independently the police
officers think it's strange because most
people don't have their doors wide open
at 2 25 in the morning so the police
officers see this and they don't go
right up to the door but you know from a
little bit far away from their vantage
point you know kind of like the
cartilage of the home they're able to
look inside the home and from there from
the the testimony from officer Dean and
from officer Carol darch is the house is
a mess essentially they say it looks
ransacked now again they didn't go right
up to it but now they have so now they
have this information a neighbor saying
it's suspicious they think it's weird
that a door is open at 2 25 in the
morning again not a typical thing and
they look in from what they can see the
house looks like it's ransacked so in
the moment they think okay we have a
burglary this is most likely a burglary
that's what happened so instead of doing
like so so now they're at a Crossroads
do they go down the Avenue of where they
do a welfare check where they walk up to
the door and knock hey I'm officer Dean
with the Fort Worth Police Department
not going to announce and if you think
it's a welfare check absolutely 100 that
is clearly what you do as a police
officer but if you think it's a burglary
if you think it's a felony and if you
think that the offender might still be
inside yet the right thing to do most of
the time is not to walk right up to the
door and announce so what the police
officers did is they decided they were
going to walk around the perimeter of
the house so walk around the perimeter
of the house and see what happens now
what you would do as a police officer
like this and it's reasonable is you
walk around the perimeter of the house
and you look for other evidence is
anyone in in distress is anyone in need
are there any other doors or windows
that might be opened that or any other
evidence of of a burglary that took
place and then what you would do is you
want to call in extra resources if you
think it's a burglary and the reason why
as a police officer why you want to walk
around the entire house first is because
you want to know what if there's no
doors in the back of a house and there's
no windows which is strange but what if
that's the case would you necessarily
need an officer to to like for sure
watch that part of the house no so
knowing how many exits and windows there
are if any of those exits or windows are
open or closed like those that is
reasonable information that you want to
give to other responding officers so I
guess what I'm saying is the idea that
the police officers didn't just go up
and knock on the door and announce
themselves initially because they
thought it could be a burglary in
progress I don't think that these
actions are unreasonable so as they're
walking around the house obviously
officer Dean has his gun drawn I mean
he's investigating a call he he thinks
it could be a felony where the offender
is inside listen any police officer in a
situation like this who doesn't have his
or her gun drawn is going to be pulled
from the street immediately and sent
back to remedial training so he has to
have his gun drawn all right so that's
that's the perspective and from the
police officer of what he knew now let's
go to Mrs Jefferson so miss Jefferson
she's 28 years old she's watching her at
the time her nephew Zion Carr was eight
years old and what had happened is
earlier in the evening they had made
hamburgers and the hamburgers
accidentally burned in order to get the
smoke and everything out of the house
they opened the door that's completely
reasonable that's what a normal person
would do when you know you accidentally
burn a hamburger and there's some smoke
in the house so so she opened the door
to the house it was 2 25 in the morning
her and her eight-year-old nephew Zion
Carr were still awake at this point and
they were playing video games while they
were playing video games at 2 25 in the
morning she hears something outside
ended up being the being the police
officers but she didn't know that she
you hear something outside and then miss
Jefferson did what most Americans would
do who are who have firearms in their
homes they grabbed their own firearm
that's what she did she grabbed her own
firearm and she went to check out what
that noise was and that's a completely
reasonable thing for Miss Jefferson to
do that's how most people would react so
what she did is she grabbed her firearm
and she started walking towards the
window it just so happened to be walking
towards the same window that officer
Dean was at and now you have the
situation so up until this point
everything that the officer did was
completely reasonable it wasn't out of
the ordinary and it was essentially
exactly what hundreds of thousands of
other police officers would have done
but the same goes for Miss Jefferson she
did exactly what a lot of what millions
of Americans would do if you hear
something in the middle of the night
outside your house you're gonna arm
yourself and you're gonna go see what it
is so at this point we have two
individuals who both made reasonable
decisions up to this Point what happens
then is that as the officer walks to the
as the officer walks towards so we have
a situation where uh the officer thinks
there could be a burglar inside the
house and Miss Jefferson thinks that
there could be a burglar outside the
house so at this point they meet at the
window as soon as they meet at the
window the officer and his body cameras
rolling the officer sees Miss Jefferson
and she sees he has a gun and his
testimony is that the gun was pointed at
him at that point he gives a Quick
Command of show me your hands show me
your hands put your hands up he says two
commands that are similar like that and
then he almost immediately fires a
single shot towards the window
unfortunately the shot did strike Mrs
Jefferson and it was a fatal injury she
did die from her injuries now let's walk
this back a little bit to see exactly
what the officer should have done so now
you have a situation where you're
investigating a felony and you're as
you're walking around the house you see
someone inside the house that has a gun
pointed towards you it's one of those
things where as a police officer that's
just a horrible just a shitty position
to be in because what do you do what do
you do how long do you if someone has a
gun pointed at you how long do you wait
before you fire your weapon I mean it's
a life and death situation and it's made
in a split second it's not a good
position for anyone to be in so in my
view for because the gun was pointed at
him it was objectively reasonable for
the officer to fire the gun at that
moment because a gun was pointed at him
so I really think unfortunately the case
is this simple either a gun is a deadly
threat or it's not if you want to make
the argument that a gun pointed at
someone is not a deadly threat I'll walk
down that path with you but if you agree
that a gun pointed at you is a deadly
threat then for the officer to not shoot
what you're saying is the officer was
facing an immediate deadly threat but we
still don't want him to shoot that just
doesn't make a whole lot of sense now
obviously we have the luxury and the
privilege of 2020 hindsight of being
able to sit in a really nice podcast
Studio or drinking Black Rifle coffee
from your favorite couch you know
exactly what happened so you have and I
have the benefit of 2020 hindsight and
if we look at the benefit of 2020
hindsight yes of course officer Dean
made the wrong decision he made the
wrong decision because Miss Jefferson
was not a burglar she was a regular
normal homeowner who was acting
reasonably she had no ill will towards
him because he was a police officer but
the thing is there is no way and it
would be literally impossible for
officer Dean to know that information at
the time and to be able to process that
information at the time so what happened
was officer Dean was charged um they did
prosecute officer Dean and he went to
trial a couple weeks ago the D.A charged
him with a couple different charges so
murder which is obviously the higher of
the charges and then manslaughter which
is a lesser charge so it did go to a
jury trial the jury found him not guilty
of the murder so they did not convict on
the murder charge but they did find
officer Dean guilty of the manslaughter
charge
um it did go to sentencing and the same
jury that convicted officer Dean is the
same jury that decided the sentence so
essentially the Reigns that we were
looking at the jury had a maximum of 20
years in prison
the given officer Dean so you know this
really says a lot about a jury and again
this isn't just a random jury or a new
jury this is a jury that heard all the
facts and found that officer Dean they
felt he was guilty Beyond A Reasonable
Doubt of manslaughter and they had the
the option to sentence him to 20 years
in prison so what they did is they
sentenced them they kind of did it in
the middle so from 0 to 20 years they
sentenced him to 11 years 10 months and
12 days
um so he will appeal that sentence like
everybody does but I mean essentially
that is that is his um that is his um uh
a sentence I'm going to address a couple
of the comments and a couple of the of
the other other questions I had about
this case so Cajun randy214. so Randy's
comment right here is going to be what a
lot of people say and let's let's
address it he cannot use self-defense if
he creates the danger That's the Law
okay creates the danger So when you say
he creates the danger you mean he's a
police officer who was dispatched to a
call that he had to go to when he gets
there he reasonably thinks it's a
burglary and then he does literally with
hundreds of thousands of other police
officers would have done does that
create the danger Randy I'm just going
to push back a little bit more as well
I'm saying so okay so if there's a if a
police officer makes the traffic stop
and the in the individual pulls out a
gun on the police officer is your
argument that the police officer can't
fire in return or can't defend him or
herself because the officer created the
danger by initiating the traffic stop so
so I I get what you're saying that's the
law but it doesn't let's see I mean he
was stalking around her house her house
okay Cajun Randy thank you that's
another argument so kind of why I
preface this the way I did is that what
a lot of people are what a lot of people
are saying is that what a lot of people
are saying Randy and here's why you're
wrong
um and here's what a lot of people are
saying is that once you get there and
the officers should have just immedi
even though they thought it was a
burglary they thought it was a felony
they thought it their was a felon
committing a crime right there people
are saying that they think the officer
should have still walked up to the house
yelled crazy crazy police police but
listen here's the thing if the if that
would have caused a real burglar inside
the house to freak out run from the
scene and then there was a subsequent
officer involved shooting the same exact
people who are complaining that the
officers did the wrong thing would be
also complaining that the officers did
that essentially this is dishonest
criticism because no matter what the
officer did if it ended up in an
officer-involved shooting people who
don't like police officers would find a
reason to critique it because what they
would say because if that's what
happened if the police officers knocked
and you know that spook the burglar and
the burglar ran and again there was a
use of force or an officer involved
shooting they would say hang on so
police officers here's what these exact
same people would say and this is why
it's frustrating here's what they would
say they would say so you police
officers get to a scene they think
there's a felony offender in there and
instead of following their training and
you know sneaking talking around the
house and using quiet deployments and
you know then trying to get in other
resources and then maybe using a PA
system once they had all the evidence so
instead of collecting that evidence and
doing good actual police work they just
barge right in because they're
heavy-handed and they just wanted to
thump someone like that's literally what
they would say so it's disarm this
criticism so
um but anyway so he was he was
um uh uh sentenced to 11 years in prison
and I get it from Miss Jefferson
standpoint she didn't do anything wrong
but it would be like I said if you don't
want the police officer to do this then
what training do you think police
officers should have when they have what
they think is a felony in progress they
get to the house and they see an open
door so so you explain to me what
training you think police officers
should do because no matter what
officers do sometimes there's going to
be an officer-involved shooting the
truth is is that situations like this
are unbelievably rare there are
approximately 250 million citizens
police interactions every year and a
situation like this happens just about
one in 250 million so I know you're
saying there's a chance but these are
absolutely 100 rare situations and it's
good that they're rare just because this
is a tragedy just because no one wanted
Miss Jefferson to die and again no one
is blaming Miss Jefferson I can't say
enough Miss Jefferson's actions are are
literally what hundreds of thousands of
millions of people around the country
myself included would have done in a
situation like this so just because it's
a tragedy doesn't mean it's criminal
doesn't mean it's a criminal offense to
me this seems like a civil case in her
and civilly her family should sue the
out of the city and get as much
money as they possibly can but I do not
think that this was a criminal case and
my opinion is that officer Dean
absolutely should not have been
prosecuted I think this is the reason
why normal reasonable good people who
want to be police officers won't be
police officers when people like this
are charged listen No One loses any any
sleep over Derek Chauvin being charged
and in prison for a killing or helping
to kill George Floyd everybody's good
with that police officers and non-police
officers alike but it's cases like this
where a reasonable police officer who
had never has had a bad use of force
says if I was in this situation I
probably would have done the same thing
these are the kinds of cases that make
people not want to be police officers uh
let's see uh Polaris man 09 he never
informed his co-worker that there was a
gun oh that's such a great Point thank
you so much Polaris man okay so think
about it this way you're right so he's
walking around so he's walking around
the house and this I'm going to talk
about the immediacy of the threat that
he saw so he's walking around the house
and all of a sudden in the window
appears someone with a gun all right so
either again either a gun is an
immediate deadly threat or it's not so
at that point he focused on the threat
and he yelled to put hands up and then
he fired so at that point once he sees
the gun if he turns to his partner he
goes hey Carol uh listen there's a lady
with a gun inside you know what do you
think we should do if that's what he
would have done well then obviously he
wouldn't have seen it as an immediate
threat and he shouldn't fire the weapon
but the the argument that a gun pointed
at you is an immediate deadly threat
there's literally nothing else you can
do um you can't have a conversation and
again again I would argue that if it's
an immediate deadly situation if he
doesn't directly address or yell at or
give commands to miss Jefferson if the
officer does anything else dishonest
critics are going to say the same thing
well I mean here he is talking to his
partner he's not even addressing Miss
Jefferson so I appreciate the comment um
that's actually what a lot of people
what a lot of people would have said and
um
and um but I I I don't think it I don't
think it makes a whole lot uh let's see
coconuts I disagree with you I disagree
wholeheartedly with you he should have
been charged with murder 11 years was a
joke he should have gotten 20 years yeah
and again reasonable people can disagree
so it's one of those things where here's
all I ask if you think that the police
officer did the wrong thing then again I
went through in detail the different
decision points the officer have so what
I would ask you to do is at what
decision point should the officer done
something different and then back that
up okay the officer gets to the house he
it looks like it could be a burglary
what's the training the officer got so
if if the officer doesn't follow
training then I'm with you at that point
I'm with you if the officer does
something not in line with being
reasonable or training then I agree with
you but again I walk through it of what
the officer did I I believe it was
reasonable if you think it wasn't again
I'm curious what you think the police
officers should do and again just
because it's a tragedy and we all all
agree it's a tragedy doesn't mean it's
criminal all right and you know what I'm
going to point to one other case so I
think when you're looking at
officer-involved shooting cases it is
just so important to be objectively
reasonable and honest and most
importantly consistent with these cases
and here's where I'm going to say
another case where I feel the exact same
way oh first I'm in Miss Jefferson so I
I should have said this earlier so if
Miss Jefferson she honestly thought the
police officer was a burglar if she
thought he was a burglar only saw his
gun didn't notice the uniform and she
would have killed him in a situation
like that I also think that would be
objectively reasonable and that criminal
charges shouldn't be filed so I want to
say that I am absolutely 100 percent
consistent with that because we have to
look at this when you have human beings
who have a gun pointed at them like we
have the luxury of being able to discuss
it in the moment it's life or death or
you don't so if Miss Jefferson had just
gone to the window seen a guy with a gun
and immediately fired I would be
advocating that there should be no
criminal charges for Miss Jefferson even
if she killed a police officer and I'm
going to circle back to a different case
where I feel the same way so this is the
Brianna Taylor case so Brianna Taylor's
boyfriend Kenny Walker he said that he
didn't know it was a police officer who
was bursting through the door so I'm not
saying I believe him or not but let's go
down that path that we believe Kenny
Walker so if we honestly believe that
Kenny Walker didn't know it was police
officers and thought it was someone
coming in the house to do him harm and
be he fires as soon as the door opens
that's reasonable that's a reasonable
thing to do and I do not think Kenny
Walker should be should be charged with
a crime Kenny Walker wasn't charged with
a crime and I think that's appropriate
if we believe his statement now on a
side note Kenny Walker is an admitted
liar and he initially told the police
officers that it was actually Brianna
Taylor who fired at them so if we take
anything that Kenny Walker says
seriously I don't know how good or
objective we are but if Kenny Walker in
his brain at the time if he honestly
thought that those weren't police
officers then I'm good with him not
being charged all right so let's see if
we have any any comments here uh
no one should be treating their own
country like a war zone or shooting
their fellow people I I agree I agree
that's not controversial uh shooting
people is bad uh Sergeant George the
definition of a tough call yeah Sergeant
George I agree it's it's a tragedy it's
a tough call and like I said I tried to
go through this with saying hey okay
here's what the officer had here's what
the decision was here's what the options
were like if you disagree with what the
officer did say this is the information
and this is where the officer made the
wrong decision so that's the kind of
stuff that I am curious about let's see
um uh yeah he was arrested and charged
and uh why not Lindy one second to do
the right thing impossible yeah so we
know that there are limits on human
behavior when it comes to the how the
human body reacts under stress so anyone
saying that the police officer should
have done something
radically differently has never been in
a position to where you had a gun
pointed at you which is a good thing but
again enjoy that privilege all right so
the next case that I want to talk about
is so you know I kind of like like to go
back and forth with these the case we
just did is one where I don't think the
police officer should have been charged
that is not the case with this so though
those people who think that I'm I'm too
pro-police which is not the case at all
but people who think I'm too Pro police
aren't going to think I'm Pro police
after this case so this is a case that
you know the best way that I can explain
it it's like if Rodney King if the
Rodney King case uh had a baby with the
George Floyd case and the OB GYN was Ben
Crump like this would be the case like
this case is absolutely nuts it's kind
of just hitting the media at least on a
national level so I've talked about this
before there's some stories that are
local stories and some that are National
stories and even though I follow police
news I'll be honest in the last couple
months this is the first time that I'd
heard about this case even though it
went down in 2019. so here's what
happened this was 2019 in Louisiana it
was the state Louisiana State Police so
Ronald green was driving a vehicle at
about 115 miles an hour well this
obviously got the attention of the of
police office officers police officers
started to follow and chase Mr Green for
driving 115 miles an hour that's how
fast the the chase got up to now at this
point all they had was speeding so it's
not like they knew that he was involved
in a robbery or a felony or anything
like that all they have is speeding so
the first criticism of the police
officers hey right then all you have is
someone speeding should police officers
Chase if all you have is a speeding
crime most of the time I'm gonna say no
that it does more bad than good for not
only the individual involved but for the
police officers and most importantly for
the general public because police chases
are so dangerous so if all you have is
speeding police officers should not be
engaged in vehicle Pursuits and a lot of
States actually have safe Pursuit acts
which outline and identify when police
officers can engage in high-speed
Pursuits and they'll states that have
those laws and almost no situation is
just speeding enough to
um uh have a vehicle Chase now police
officers can have a helicopter follow
someone that's different than an actual
vehicle just anyway so police officers
did decide to chase Ronald green it went
on for a while finally Ronald green
crashed the car and you can predict what
happens when the car crashes it's
swarmed by police officers that's
another thing so in a situation like
this what a lot of time you know what we
what police officers should do when it
comes to training and anyone who has
more experience in training in tactics
than me definitely put in the comments
if you think that I am saying something
that is not correct but typically when
you have a situation like this when you
have someone who I mean running from
police is a felony so now you have
someone who committed a felony the car
crashed the car stopped so what should
the officers do in a situation like that
should they run up to the car all crazy
crazy no that is absolutely not what
they should do they should Park their
cars behind they should get on the PA
system they should all jump out with
different Force arrays what I mean by
that I didn't say that is articulately
as I wanted to but but different
different weapon systems so someone
might have a bean bag shotgun someone
else might have a 40 millimeter someone
might have a taser and then obviously
individuals police officers with
Firearms as well so a Force array
different options of force and get on
the PA system and try to give the
individual commands to come out now if
there's a long time and the individual
isn't coming out then the police
officers can have a dog go up there they
can do a tactical approach but I know
that in a situation like this that
adrenaline is running and pumping
through your veins and as soon as that
car crashes you just want to snatch the
guy and get him out so he can't keep
running and evading like I I've been
there and I get it but that is not
technically the right thing to do but
that's what the officers did so there
were six of them they rushed up to the
car and they essentially pulled them out
of the car now there is some evidence
that he resisted arrest at this point
meaning he didn't just get out of the
car so he said things to make it seem
like he wasn't resisting like I'm one of
you I'm scared I'm sorry so he was
saying the right things however he
wasn't actively trying to get out of the
car police officers did have to pull him
out of the car and there was some use of
force in order to get him into handcuffs
and I'm gonna be honest I watched some
of the body camera footage that's
available there's a 46 minute body cam
clip out there I don't really see two
too many issues with use of force
getting him into handcuffs okay I know
that was a situation like this that
temperatures are going to rise that's
what happens when you run from police
and there's a car chase and I mean you
would expect you wouldn't expect police
officers to have all of this adrenaline
running through through their veins and
their bodies and then all of a sudden at
the at the at the stop of a dime just be
able to change that so they're
reasonable and docile humans like that
that isn't how human behavior or
psychology works so you know that the
police officers are going to be a little
amped up
um but the use of force didn't look
terrible or or really out of policy or
illegal until he was in handcuffs now
the rule is and this is the rule no
matter what no matter if it is a
murderer if it is a a child sex predator
it doesn't matter or a drunk driver it
doesn't matter once the handcuffs are on
the fight is over period there are no
exceptions so the criticisms I have on
this I'll have a lot of them but the
first major criticisms that I have when
it comes to the use of force is that the
use of force didn't stop once the
handcuffs are on so the police officers
utilize force on Mr Green once he was on
his belly in handcuffs laying on the
side of the road they still continue to
utilize force on the mid one point for
I'm not sure what reason one of the
officers grabs his legs and kind of
drags him along the sidewalk along along
the pavement and then and maybe this
wasn't the training back in 2005 like
when I started but certainly it's been
the training before 2019 because we all
see what happens when you leave someone
who is in some kind of distress in
handcuffs especially if they're a bigger
heavier person like Mr Green was leaving
them on their belly in handcuffs to just
lay there and that's what they did they
left Mr Green laying on the side of the
road on his stomach for nine minutes
eventually he went limp is what they
said once Mr Green went limp they it
once Mr Green went limp they did set him
up they had Rescue come and he died on
his way to the hospital so by the time
he got to the hospital he was deceased
one of the first indicators that
something wasn't right about this is the
story that the doctors at the hospital
got from the police officers was that Mr
Green died in a car crash well Mr Green
had taser prongs in him which he was
tased when he was still in the car when
he was resisting don't have an issue
with the use of a taser at that point
but he had taser prongs at him and
obvious other evidence that he had been
in a physical scuffle with police
officers but the doctors were like this
guy didn't die in a car crash so the
first kind of the first red flag or the
first time anyone said what happened
here was actually the doctors at the
emergency room who the story from police
just didn't match up to the evidence
they had when they were evaluating Mr
Green but he was deceased also you know
Mr Green has a family so you know what
the police department told his family
initially that he died in a car crash
that he was running from police officers
he crashed into a tree and when police
officers got there he died they also
sent out a one-page news release saying
that exact same thing it's obviously not
true so I know that a lot of times
conspiracy theory and people think you
know that there's a cover-up there's a
cover-up or you know the government's
lying to us or at their local police
departments aren't telling the truth
well sometimes that's the case and a lot
of times a lot of us look at that with a
grain of salt because we remember the
other lies right we remember them saying
that George Floyd didn't resist arrest
we remember them saying that Brianna
Taylor was asleep in her bed and and
there was no threat to police officers
and they just shot her for no reason we
remember them saying that Jacob Blake he
was just there to pick up his kids and
he had was unarmed and he didn't pose
any threat to police officers so when
it's the same people who are saying
those lies saying that there's a
government cover-up it's reasonable to
be to to question it however I think in
a case like this we have enough evidence
to know that there was something strange
going on and let me add a little more
fuel to that fire also it took over two
years for the body cam to be released to
the public which is which is nuts I
think everyone knows I mean I work here
at cops and cons TV so obviously we are
mostly a body cam Channel we want body
cam we want as much footage to come out
as possible not just because I'm nosy
but because I really want to know what
happens and I'm interested I think it's
unbelievably interesting the interaction
especially in important cases when it
comes to Citizen and police interaction
we love that that's why we have this
channel so we want the potty cam footage
so the Louisiana state place to not
release it for two years is absolutely
unacceptable not only that the police
officers weren't charged for three years
until after the incident all six of them
were charged one officer actually is
deceased and there were there's only
five of them who are charged right now
one of the involved officers um he
actually died in a car crash um sometime
in between 2019 now so there are five
different police officers who are
charged um
um you know the the the the main thing
that I want to say about a case like
this oh I also talk about the
administrative investigation and so
those of you who know police officers or
are police officers foreign police
officers you know that admin and admin
and they they investigate everything
okay so there's always an administrative
investigation sometimes if an officer
doesn't have their seatbelt on or is
eating McDonald's as they're driving
someone to jail it's captured on their
body cam video sometimes that's the type
of stuff that admin investigations
um uh the police department spent time
and resources investigating these kind
of things and we can all look and say
this is silly and but it can
also swing the other way and that's what
happened here so here you have an in
custody death all right there wasn't an
administrative investigation didn't even
start for 446 days so you know what is
that I don't know I'm uh a little over a
year a year and a hundred days for an
administrative investigation to start to
look into exactly what happened
um also you know within a week or so the
police department put out a a news
release specifically also saying that
you know the police officer's actions
were Justified again they said that
before they did any kind of
Investigation some of the police
officers that has been some of the body
cam footage that's been obtained is that
they um said things on body cam footage
after so one of the police officers
um he here's what's captured in the body
camera footage he's driving to the
hospital and he calls his supervisor and
it seems like he didn't realize he was
he was recording this all right but as
he was driving to the hospital he calls
a sergeant and he basically tells the
sergeant what happened he says that
there was a physical fight and then he
said we beat the living out of him
he said we choked him
um so these are the kinds of things that
were the officer was saying to his
supervisor right after the case so the
idea that you know okay so I I some
police apologists or you know people who
just might think that the police always
do good which again it's not always the
case and it's important to be honest and
objective a lot of people might say well
you know if if they weren't on scene and
their supervisors three or four level
levels up like maybe they just didn't
know so maybe they were just taking the
words of the five or six bad cops who
were on scene maybe they were just
taking their words but here we have body
cam footage where he's telling his
Sergeant there was a physical fight we
him up and we choked him um so uh
it seems like that's strange um we will
definitely
um also not all six of the police
officers had their body cameras on I
think that's problematic and also uh
during this um body cameras were muted
meaning that there was video but no
audio for a lot of this incident as well
most police departments and reasonable
police departments so on body cameras
there A lot of times there is a mute
function where you know you can you can
mute what you're saying now maybe some
people say that should never be allowed
well here's why it was allowed you can
imagine a situation where police
officers are on scene and they have
someone in custody and then you know
maybe they want to discuss the charges
amongst themselves you know about hey
what should we charge this person with
or maybe they're going to call the D.A
or you can imagine a situation where
there's other conversations that that
you know maybe you don't want on body
camera where you can even say maybe
that's reasonable but it's abused more
than anything so what most police
departments have done is they have
either eliminated the mute function or
they've created a policy that says hey
if your body cameras on you can't mute
or turn it off unless you say why say
okay I'm going to call the da to discuss
Charges going to be muting it so a lot
of police departments have um have uh
things like that policies like that uh
let's see
um
uh Da Vinci wants to know about FTX
maybe we'll talk about that here in a
little bit Sergeant George um this is my
training for police officers is so very
important especially when it pertains to
the use of body cams 100 and it's not
only see if you agree Sergeant George
it's not only training but it's also
policy you know um you have to have the
right policy if if you if you just tell
police officers yeah go ahead and you
use your body cameras in situations
where you think you might get a
complaint not good enough you have to
have a policy that says when police
officers are engaged in law enforcement
activities that's when they need to have
their body cameras rolling and you need
to Define law enforcement activity so if
you're on a call for service if you're
on a traffic stop if you're flagged down
by someone all of that should be
recorded that's law enforcement
activities what's not a law enforcement
activity let's say an officer gets out
to use the bathroom at a gas station
let's say he talks to the clerk as he's
buying some coffee that's not law
enforcement activity let's say the
police officers are on their lunch break
and they're at a donut shop or they're
at the gym working out we have a couple
different kinds of police officers so
those are the situations no you
shouldn't have your body camera rolling
while you're running on the treadmill
that's absolutely silly a boring
sandwich says not full transparency but
certainly you don't boring sandwich
certainly you don't think that police
officers should have their body cameras
rolling while they're at the gym at the
substation on their lunch break I'm
guessing uh let's see if we have any
other comments on this uh those are the
officers Lori Bowles those are the
officers that need to be held
accountable and that's the thing Lori we
all agree we all agree I haven't heard
any police officers and I'm on a lot of
groups on Facebook and Instagram and
Tick Tock and Twitter and everywhere I
haven't heard any police officers trying
to justify what the officers did in the
Ronald green case so you know when you
have a situation where there are a lot
of police officers saying like in the
Garrett Roth case like we talked about
or in the the Aaron Dean case that we
talked about when you have a lot of
police officers who again don't have
histories of being heavy-handed looking
at a case and going well I probably
would have done the same thing like if
that if you have reasonable cops who are
saying that like that's when you need to
pause but when you have cases like this
there are zero reasonable places officer
saying that oh yeah what the officers
did here is completely fine literally no
one is saying that same thing about the
George Floyd case okay that's no one is
saying oh yeah I see what they did that
was reasonable to put his knee like that
when he was laying there no one
literally nobody says that so um yeah
just wanna uh let's see okay boring
sandwich no more encrypted radios either
okay yeah I see I see I see that point
uh let's see uh let's see uh Willie we
uh we have people in here talking about
uh uh talking about
um marijuana I guess okay anyway so that
was the Ronald uh Ronald green case like
I said it's an absolute tragic case
absolutely 100 never never should have
happened and we're gonna follow this
case like I said the five officers um
who are still with us on this planet
have just been charged last thing I want
to say about this case is kind of like
in the George Floyd case my guess is
that not all the officers are going to
be as guilty as each other meaning look
at George Floyd Derek Chauvin was
clearly more culpable than the guy guy
who was two officers down who was on
George Floyd's feet and really there was
an officer in between and literally
couldn't see what Derek Chauvin was
doing so there's different levels of
culpability and my guess is that's what
we're going to see here in this case is
that not every officer is as guilty as
the other ones uh let's see gone while
cops are far from perfect but when
people defend okay uh let's see
um
criminals that's what I have a problem
with yeah we all have a problem with
with criminals absolutely aiding and
abetting is just as guilty Cajun Randy
it is yeah if someone either that's a
crime that's absolutely the case but you
have to know that a crime is occurring
if you don't know a crime is occurring
then you're not aiding and abetting all
right the next case I want to talk about
and I mean this this one is this case an
absolute tragedy as well
um for three different lives were lost
in this case and this happened in Bay St
Louis Mississippi this was about two
weeks ago and this just shows you that
as a police officer that you just never
know so I mean I've been on thousands of
traffic stops with people probably
hundreds thousands of people who are
hardened criminals had felonies on their
record had been to prison and thankfully
no one not one of them ever shot at me
but you have a situation like this and
the police officers were shot at and
it's by someone that you would
absolutely never think would do that and
that's the that that's the thing about
being a police officer you could have
someone who just got out of prison doing
20 years and is now involved in criminal
activity you tell them they're under
arrest and they they're nice and they
comply and they're friendly and they say
all right you got me and they don't
resist and then you have someone who has
zero criminal history who all of a
sudden for no reason pulls out a gun and
starts shooting at police officers when
they're not even going to be arrested
and that's the scary thing about being a
police officer is because you just never
know so this was a welfare check at the
Motel 6 police officers in Bay St Louis
Mississippi officers Brandon estorff he
was 23 years old and Sergeant Stephen
Robin uh is 34 years old they went to
this welfare check and they contacted
someone named Amy Amy Anderson she was a
veterinarian and she was in her car in
the parking lot I think the hotel had
called because they were concerned about
her they requested a welfare check so
police officers contact Ms Anderson
again she's a seemingly a normal person
she's a veterinarian and she has her
child her ten-year-old daughter with her
in the car police officers end up
talking to miss miss Anderson for about
between 30 to 40 minutes and during that
time for some reason they come to the
opinion that something isn't right and
that the child just maybe not be safe so
what they do is the right thing they
decide to involve child protective
services so you know people always say
you know well not police officers
shouldn't just go to everything they
should call out social workers that's
literally what they did in this case so
instead of just you know taking the
child from the mom and you know putting
the mom in jail no they wanted to call
out literally the experts on these type
of issues with families and children so
they called out Child Protective
Services to see if they could also
investigate to try to figure out what's
best for these two individuals while
they were waiting for child protective
services really without any warning Miss
Anderson pulls out a gun and she shoots
both officers
um officer estorff he died
[Music]
um officer Robin or Sergeant Robin he
died right there in the parking lots
officer restorff was able to fire run
one round back at Miss Anderson
um she suffered a fatal gunshot wound as
well the child was not hurt and um but
unfortunately officer store he was
transported by the hospital and he
passed away on his way to the hospital
but he did get off one round and the
main thing that I want to say about that
is you just never know interviews that
have been public with her family and the
people that she worked with they all
said we had no idea like we never would
have expected this so it's one of those
things where if you have if you have if
you have an individual who
um if you have someone who is very close
friends and family if they don't know or
have any idea that someone might do this
or that this is capable in them then how
would police officers who just meet
someone for 30 minutes with someone
without any criminal history how would
you possibly know so it's cases like
this where you say you know why are
police officers on edge well it's
because of cases like this if police
officers were never killed or shot at by
seemingly normal people then police
officers wouldn't have a reasonable fear
that sometimes things can go bad and why
police officers always want to see
someone's hands and know where they are
so that's completely reasonable uh let's
see
um
uh Stephen Riley said good shooting I'm
not sure what that means but um but uh
Sergeant George says being a police
officer is very dangerous plain and
simple yeah no it absolutely it
absolutely is and I'm sure that there's
other jobs that are statistically more
dangerous but the difference with those
jobs are most of the time it's that what
makes being a police officer different
it's typically not people who are
risking their well being a police
officer is typically people who are
risking their lives to make everyone
safe and going down that path when they
are killed because bad people don't want
to be held accountable that strikes a
court in people yes being a lumberjack
is dangerous being being a shrimp boat
captain is dangerous being a long-haul
trucker is dangerous statistically maybe
even more dangerous but when it's
another human being who's taking the
life of a police officer when that
police officer was trying to do the
right thing
um it I mean that strikes a chord in
people and we know that it does I'm not
saying anything that's controversial
that's why police shows have been the
most popular TV and movies sent for
forever for 100 years that's why people
because people are interested in this
let's see uh boring how much I wish
police didn't have extra Privileges and
protections okay if we acted like them
we'd be in prison uh
uh okay yeah that doesn't make any sense
but
that's okay
um let's see any other comments on that
case yeah okay so the one of the last
cases got two more cases I want to talk
about and the first one and I kind of
mentioned Brianna Taylor's boyfriend
Kenny Walker earlier but he was in the
news about two weeks ago so I want to I
want to catch everybody up on what
Kenny's been up to so again Kenny Walker
was Brianna Taylor's boyfriend
um he's the one who shot at police again
he's an admitted liar because he said
that you know when the police officers
came through he said I didn't know that
they were police and then he initially
told police officers it was Brianna
Brianna is the one who shot so if you're
Pro Briana Taylor you know he's
basically blaming her for shooting at
police officers nice guy huh he's trying
to put the blame on her so I think we
should all have opinions on Kenny Walker
and basically you know we should have
really questioned the veracity of a lot
of his statements right um anyway so but
he did Sue the city of Louisville which
he wasn't injured and he was actually
never charged he was never prosecuted
for those crimes um you know he was held
in custody after he shot a police
officer for a couple hours which is
completely reasonable because he shot a
police officer but again he ended up not
being prosecuted he did Sue the city I'm
not sure on what grounds he sued the
city because uh again this doesn't make
a whole lot of sense but he sued the
city in the city of Louisville who is
just about to go under a consent decree
or is involved in a consent decree with
the Department of Justice so maybe this
is a politics wrapped in there but he
just settled a two million dollar
lawsuit with the city of Louisville so
so
um uh Kenny Walker who shot a police
officer and blamed Brianna Taylor for it
is uh now a two million dollar man so
um yeah just wanted to just wanted to
put that out there I think that's
something that everybody should know
um last case I want to talk about and
before we go into the Christmas holiday
or and again today's Festivus so happy
Festivus but before we let everyone go
into the Christmas holiday I just want
to talk about one more case so this last
case and I want to go out on a high note
I want to go out on a good story so this
has happened a couple days ago on
December 19th this happened in Dearborn
Michigan so Dearborn Michigan it was
about 3 3 30 in the afternoon and an
individual his name is Ali nahi Naji I'm
gonna call him Ali because I don't say
his last name but Ali walks into the
police station in Dearborn Michigan and
the way that police station is set up is
essentially there's glass and it's
bulletproof glass and there's a uniform
police officer sitting behind that class
you know in case people need to come in
and make reports or you know need other
resources so as soon as Ali walked in he
pulled out a firearm without saying
anything and he pulled out a firearm
pointed at the police officer and
started pulling the trigger in response
the police officer also pulled out his
his firearm and started shooting at Ali
thankfully the there was a malfunction
with Alice firearm and it didn't fire
um also thankfully the police officer
did not have that problem the police
officer's weapon it did fire uh Mr Ali
was shot multiple times and he was
killed
um he uh turns out that he had a stolen
firearm so that gun did jam it was a
stolen firearm also he had a history
history of mental illness now exactly
why he walked into the police station
that day they're actually still trying
to figure out the motive for that but
this is about the second or third case
in the last couple weeks where someone
has gone to a police station fired a gun
at police officers and it didn't end up
good for them so not sure what's going
on why people are doing that but again
it's like the third case that I've seen
first one I've covered on here but this
has happened
um at least three times in the last
couple weeks so that's going to be our
show for today
um I just want to thank everyone for
coming by and being a part of the show
really appreciate
um all of the comments and again I hope
everyone has a really great safe and
happy uh Festivus and Christmas stay
safe out there please don't drink and
drive there's no excuse call Uber or
Lyft and help everybody enjoys time with
their family thank you