Nobody can take pictures of the front gate. That's a security thing. Yeah, I know but you're taking pictures of the front of the gate. That's a security thing for us. Yeah, yeah. Hey, we're going to have you be on this side. Yeah, you can't come up. You can't record right here. You got to stay right over here. >> What do you mean I got to stay over here? When a citizen who clearly understands their rights stands up to law enforcement, the situation quickly turns into a tense confrontation. No, it is illegal to walk on one on with a skateboard or even walk with Not there. I think >> Listen, you don't need What are you doing? I'm recording the computers over here. Is it open? No, it's not. And just a few minutes of abusing authority on camera can lead to consequences that may bring an officer's entire career crashing down. A quiet afternoon at the north gate of Dover Air Force Base. But just seconds after a man raises his camera, the situation suddenly becomes tense. What's up, man? I'm just taking some pictures. I think the flags and stuff look nice. What's that? No, no. That's why I'm not going on base. I'm just taking the flags and what Yeah, you can't get the picture of the That's why I don't want to go on the Nobody can take pictures of the front gate. That's a security thing. Yeah, that's why I'm not going on there, though. You're not What do you mean you're not going on there? Yeah, you're not going on I'm not going in there. No, I don't want to go in there. Yeah, but you See how you got picture right here? Hey, I got the front and the flags. It's cool. I mean it's in if I take a picture of that, it's in there, too. So, I mean I I just want to take a picture of this stuff. It's all Yeah, I know but you're taking pictures of the front of the gate. That's Yeah, yeah. That's a problem. Hey, have you come out here and done this before? [music] Not here, no. But I go all over the place. >> Okay. No, as long as I stay on public, you know, there's no issue with it. Well, actually you're not on [music] public anymore. Once you pass So, if you go to the bridge, there's red lines. Now, we own this jurisdiction right here. Well, I checked it out. I thought it was a public street. What about half that? And once you go through the other side, too, the other side of the bridge, then that's our jurisdiction, too. I got lost and I came off this exit. Yeah, they If anyone can drive through, then I can stand here, then. Okay, I'll go bring someone to come talk to you, okay? >> All right, that's fine. I just want to Yeah, I want to get it cleared up. I'm not in my AOR right now. So, I'm going to bring someone to come talk to you, okay? Perfect, man. Appreciate it. >> Yeah, no problem. All right, so you didn't come up here trying to film my stuff, did you? Yeah, yeah. I just I seen on Google Maps like the Google car came through here and took pictures of all this and it's online. Like it's all on Google Maps. The debate over filming outside the base gate was far from over. And at that moment, another officer appeared. Bringing questions that made the atmosphere even more tense. Yeah, I'd more information on it. It'll help you out a little bit. Yeah, I just seen like uh Yeah, I just seen like Google Maps has gotten all the pictures of all this. It's all over Google Maps. So, anybody on their phone can go on there and get the same pictures. Uh I just try to write stories and stuff. So, I'm just doing like taking some pictures and video and trying to get a little like news story going or something. I just like the flags and stuff. Yeah, I'm just taking pictures for a story I'm working on. What's our jurisdiction right here? So, this is still our jurisdiction right here. That's what you're trying to trying to say. Um I guess. I just like I don't know. I mean anybody's going to get up with Google Maps settings. They got pictures of all this all online. And anybody can see it. >> He'll He'll explain a little more to you, okay? Yeah, it's cool. Yeah, that's fine. I mean I just got here. It's the least. I mean I wasn't planning on staying for a little I I I didn't even see you. It was It was my other gentleman that told me you were up here. No, that's fine. Yeah, I mean I'm not trying to hide, you know. So, I mean we can clear it up. I'm fine with that. How you doing, there, sir? Good. How you doing, sir? All right. Now, sir, why are you taking videos of the base? I'm just doing a little work on a little news story. News story? Yeah, so I'm just getting some pictures and stuff. I'm just independent. >> Okay, do you have any type of identification card on you or anything? No, no. I didn't bring anything. It was a long ride up one. So, I didn't carry a lot of stuff with me. So. >> Okay, you're just on your skateboard? Yeah, yes, sir. >> Okay, so you rode up one on your skateboard? Uh no, I walked down the guardrail, though. Okay, so you walked down the guardrail. Okay. Just so you know, I'm I can't enforce those rules but just know it is illegal to walk on one on with a skateboard or even walk with Not there. I think once you get to the toll cuz I grew up and there's no signs that say no pedestrians. No, I grew up I don't want to argue with you, sir. I mean I'm not disrespecting you. Um we just got to We find it weird that you're out here taking video of the base without a like a public media permit. Once you have that, you'd be able to do that. >> Yeah. That's why I'm in public, though. I don't want to go on If I went on base, I'm sure you guys would have to give me some kind of permission to take pictures on base. That's why I don't want to go on base. >> Yeah, that's that's fine but we got to find out why cuz normally even like the local news agency when they come sit out here, they have a media permit. After explaining that he was simply working on an independent news story, the cameraman remained calm despite a series of questions from security personnel. And as officers began discussing their next move among themselves, a new message came over the radio. Signaling that this situation might be far more complicated than it first appeared. I just like the military. It's I think it's a cool area. I like the sign here with the flags flying. It's nice. I just want to get some cool pictures and stuff. So. Obviously, I'm not trying to stop you from writing whatever you're going to write. But you have to understand from the aspect of us cuz you know, we're we're on high alert at all times. Yeah, I understand. When we have people filming us, we kind of have to understand why they're doing it. Yeah, yeah. I got you, man. I appreciate it. Oh, yeah. That's why I don't want to go on base or I'm not I'm trying not trying to hide, you know. I'm visible out here. So, uh that's all. Cuz I mean like I was telling him, if you look on Google Maps, you can drop the pin right here and they drove the car right around there. And all what I'm getting pictures of is already all online. So, nothing It's just my picture now. That way I mean I don't There's no copyright issues so I can't get out of it. I got my own stuff. I don't worry about Okay, um well, since you don't have any identification on you, is there any way I can get some No, I'm not trying to do that today. Okay, okay. Then um do you have So, you don't want to give any information. See, that's where we're finding it iffy like why don't you want to let us do our job if we're letting you do your job? What do you What do you mean by doing your job? We're I'm doing my job by trying to find out who you are and why you're doing it. I'm just a journalist doing a news story. >> Okay, but I feel like a journalist would give me information. So, by you not giving me information, it kind of gives me the aspect that you're trying to do negative harm to us. Yeah, that's not true. You shouldn't jump to that conclusion, either. I'm just I need to be anonymous. Not at this point but when I'm out here, it is, you know, like when people when I'm doing but my job out here taking them. But when I write, obviously it's not going to be anonymous. But but when I'm out here, I just must remain anonymous here. The cameraman insisted on his right to film in a public place while security personnel argued that they needed to verify his identity for the base's security. This difference in perspective quickly escalated the conversation. And when another officer stepped into the discussion, the situation began to shift into a more intense phase. Doing pretty well. How are you? I'm going to be cool with you. I just want to be cool with you. Yeah, yeah. I'm just trying to take some pictures, man. That's all. What's What's going on? Just here to take some pictures. I think it's a cool site. You know, the flags are half-staff. I thought it looked nice. So. Did you ask for any information beforehand? No, no. That's why I didn't go on base cuz then I would need permission from them. >> you but you got to understand what Yeah, yeah. I told him everything I'm doing. So, I mean I already talked to him about it. I got you but it's better not to say you know in the climate today. You're taking pictures of cars coming in and out and through the base area. I'm not worried about the cars, man. I got you. I got you but we don't know that. I'm telling you now. All right, is this a public road here at this area? No. It It really isn't. Everything you're doing now is It's military installation. So. So, I'm trespassing right now. Do you guys want me to leave? Is that what it is? >> Look, the main thing right now I've already made contact with you. I just need to get your information. I'm going to do my checks. If you're good, you're good. All right, and it's also up to them cuz you're on their property. I have to talk to them again. Uh since we're at the military base, I mean that sounds pretty awful the way you just said that there. What do you mean? He just need to run my name and then if I'm if there's nothing wrong with my name Well, hold on. Hold on. Hold on. Let me finish what I'm saying. If there's nothing wrong with my name, which is far as like I don't have a warrant or something, then I'm I'm good to keep filming here. Absolutely. You're good to go. Now, as long as they don't they have nothing else with you, you're good to go. Go back where you No, no, sir. I mean if you if you wanted to come take a picture like this, fine. Like I understand you >> That's all I I was literally here 30 seconds. No way. No way. Well, the only issue is I came I literally got to where his car is parked and can't remember his name but the young gentleman came out within 30 seconds. I had barely had time to turn my cameras on. And the only reason I understand that. I why I talked to him. I didn't yell and scream at him. Like I don't I'm not trying to cause trouble here. I'm just trying to get a some picture. He said there's nothing wrong with that. So then I don't understand the problem. Yeah. I'm not trying to be a dick here. Police requested his identity for a check while the cameraman insisted he had the right to refuse since there was no sign of any wrongdoing. This disagreement made the situation more tense until officers began reviewing the legal boundaries of the area, opening the door to a new turning point. I'm out here to get some pictures, man. I don't know what the big deal is. Obviously, I haven't talked to you yet. So I What's going on? I just literally got to where his car is parked. Set my Yes, sir. Set my stuff up. And I think it was uh Stanton came out, talked to me. I told him what I was doing. I was here to get a couple pictures of the front and the flags here and the sign. It's nice. And then uh this other gentleman back here came out in one of these vehicles. I told him the same thing that I told him. Um and that was it. I mean, no one was yet asked me to leave. I mean, I heard you guys talking about trespass over there, but I've not been asked to leave. >> Yes, that was that was the discussion we had with the lieutenant. >> I mean, I as far as I know, I'm allowed to be here right where I am. >> come in here and turn around all day cuz they get misdirected. So for the jurisdictional maps that's issued between the city of Delaware and the Eastern commander, the jurisdictional boundary is the edge of that overpass. Not right here. So you can go up there. You can film as much as you want, but you can't just Now, what's what's prohibiting me from taking pictures here? You are I think you should be taking pictures. >> Technically on a federal installation up until that overpass. Regardless of if you cross the plane of the gates or not, this is federal property. All right. Then I got to leave, I'll leave. I'm cool here. All right, I'm done with that. I don't know what this guy is doing out here on the side of the highway. He's doing like some ninja moves meditation. So here's the red line we're talking about, I think. So there's one here on the overpass right there. And then there's one also on that street light right there. Finally, after a series of tense arguments, the legal boundaries of the area were clarified. The cameraman decided to leave the spot to avoid any unnecessary legal trouble, bringing the prolonged confrontation outside the base gate to an end. Up next, outside the Hillsborough police station things suddenly seemed unusual as numerous police vehicles, task force units, and even a SWAT vehicle filled the area. A curious cameraman moved closer to see what was happening, but just seconds later the situation became tense. Somebody's getting ready for something. Looks like a SWAT vehicle. A whole bunch of other vehicles. What's happening? What are we getting ready for? Hey, we're going to have you get on this side. Yeah, you can't film you can't record like Here, you got to stay right over here. >> What do you mean I got to stay over here? This is >> stay over here. There's a business need you can't use this public sidewalk, but you're welcome to stand there if you like. At least you're that way you're in the shade. What? Yeah, you can't film the computers that they're using. Well, what are they doing? They're working. Right, in the in the public setting, right? This is public parking lot. Police station. >> And right now we have a command post up right here. Where? This car. All right. You can stand right here. I don't want to stand in the road. I'm going to stand on the sidewalk. Okay, well Why should I stand on the road? >> I just told you. Huh? I just told you cuz we have a command post So you want me to be in the in the You're not in the road, sir. You're in the parking lot. Yeah, for vehicles. So you can go over there to the front door area. No. No, 10 ft is more than enough. >> No, it's not, sir. You Listen, you don't need What are you doing? >> You're not recording the computers over here. Is it open? No, it's not. It is open. It's in public view, right? >> It is not right now. >> It's plain view. What you're doing actually is you're blocking my camera. Do you know what that is? >> your camera. Yeah, that's prior restraint. You need to get your supervisor here. Identify yourself. You're the supervisor? Identify yourself. Hey. You got my name tag >> You're intimidating me right now. No, the law says the law says you need to identify yourself. What is your name and badge number? Sergeant Denagalski, I'm Lieutenant Bond. Lieutenant, what the hell's going on here? Why am I being intimidated this way and you're not stepping in right away? >> All right, that's why I was walking over here to talk Can you stop yelling at me, please? No, I'm not cuz now you've aggravated me. I just walked up You just walked up here harassing me, threatening me, violating my constitutional rights? >> you yelling? Cuz I can. Okay. You got a problem with that? Well, it's not very polite. I don't give a damn if it's not polite. It's against the law to harass me. The cameraman believed he was standing in a public area and that recording was therefore legal while police cited operational reasons to order him to step back. This disagreement quickly made the situation tense and just seconds later an action by one of the officers caused the conversation to escalate. Exactly, I walked up to you cuz I can cuz you're in public. Well, actually we can have operations Yeah. >> from the public. How? Outside of the building? Yes. No, no signs, no no tape, no nothing? Would you like me to get some tape? >> Yeah, get some tape. Get some tape and put it on. >> If you want to walk over there >> Actually, no. Put on the tape and then I'll comply. Right now, you are more than 10 ft, more than enough. Understand? More than enough. Can you stop yelling at me? No, I'm not until you actually do your job properly. You're the one That's what it requires for you fools, tyrants, to do your jobs correctly. You immediately escalated this thing the moment I walked up with the camera. You, too. You're the lieutenant. You're supposed to put your sergeant in check right away. Your sergeant came in here aggressively at me. >> keep interrupting me. We can't have a conversation. >> Well, then go do your damn job. Put up the tape and do your damn job. Dismissed. Put up the tape. Get to putting up your tape. No, until you put up your tape, I am more than sufficiently enough from where I need to be. Hi, my name's Brian Wolfer, I'm the commander here at the patrol division. >> I don't give a damn what you are anymore, commander. Go do your damn job. >> is what we're going to do and I'm going to let you know, okay? We're going to put up some tape right here just so that you're aware that that's the area you can't pass. The reason why you can't come here and while it is a public accessible space because it's currently being used for an operational need. Do you have any questions on how I can help you with that? I'm happy to help you in any way. Commander, did you see your sergeant over there escalate the situation and aggressively approach me? I was aware and I didn't see it as escalation. Sorry you felt that way. Oh, you did not see him stick his camera? Stick his hand into my camera? I'm asking you questions. Did you witness him stick his hand and agreeing admitting on record that that's what he's doing? right there. So if you want to check it out, they're going to put some tape here and we're going to put it around here. You're welcome to stand anywhere outside that tape. Absolutely. And then what I want you to do is when you stand somewhere just if you could be safe. Okay? The cameraman argued that police were deliberately obstructing his recording while officers insisted the area needed to be restricted due to operational needs. This difference in perspective made the situation increasingly tense until a senior commander stepped in and proposed a way to handle it. Whenever the tape is here, whenever the tape is here, that's when I'll be. It doesn't actually have to be a physical boundary. I could tell you and as long as you're No, you have to give me a lawful order. You don't just create a boundary to intimidate me and to and to create a chilling effect on my first amendment. >> Is there something that you would like to have access to? Yeah. What is that? I want to be able to see exactly what you're doing because it's publicly accessible and if you chose to do so in public, if you chose to do so in public, it's plain view. If you chose to do so in public, it's plain view. Do you have any questions I can help you with? All right. If you're not happy with any service, you're welcome to file a complaint. You can do that online. You can do it in >> Yeah, I just did. I just I'm going to file a complaint with you on the spot. I want you to go and reprimand that sergeant. That There's nothing I can do there for for his aggression. get your information so that I can follow up with you on No, you don't need my information. I want to be able to tell you how the complaint resolves. I I know how the complaint gets resolved. Thank you. If you can just let me >> know exactly how. You pretend nothing happened and that's it. The situation seemed to calm down when the police decided to put up warning tape to mark the restricted area. But just as things appeared to settle, another exchange between the cameraman and the officers sparked an entirely new debate. Why are you all running those vehicles with no occupants in them? Just burning gas. Who's the AC running for? A ghost? Sure. Sometimes the vehicles have to ran cuz there's a lot of equipment in there and the equipment will actually kill the batteries of the vehicles. You don't have a backup battery in there? They probably do, but if we don't run them if depending on how long all the equipment's running for, it will kill the battery and then we have to bring another car over here and get it jump-started. So all the vehicles that are not running, for example, all your all your police vehicles. Well, you put me in this situation. You told me to stand here, didn't you? Didn't you tell me to stand right here in this area? And now I now I'm in danger. I don't want to stand over there 20 ft, 30 ft, 50 ft away. I want to be able to stand 10 ft away. So why why don't you why don't you just make it over here, right? So at least I can see and hear some of it. No, you specifically did it 200 500 ft away. That's not 200 ft. Well, you don't think that's Let's see. From from this point to that point, you don't think that's 200 ft? That's 500 ft. You can point your camera to see if anybody else agrees. I want to stand right here. So, move your tape over here. That's that's enough. >> I make you aware of a case law? Just where it Yes. So, uh just so you don't get in trouble for something like this in the future. Like in the Get in trouble? And I can give you Well, so there's actually some state case law Sure. of people interfering with investigations filming the police. I don't want you to do that. >> State State the case for me. Yeah, it's State v. Gardner. Uh-huh. Uh do you want me to give you the spelling of it? >> No, I know it. It's You know it? Just Just say what it says. Tell me what it says. So, that was actually Hillsborough case. Now, you can look it up and make your own interpretation. That was a Hillsborough Police Department case where somebody actually interfered while an investigation while filming. They were arrested and the court of appeals upheld it. I don't want you to get in trouble for something similar. So, you can look it up. State v. Gardner. No. Uh and don't do something similar to >> pull up that statute and look at the very first case that says, "Freedom of speech, speech alone does not constitute obstruction or interfering." False. And if you want to try that with me again, try it. Although no arrest occurred, the incident still raises serious questions about how law enforcement applies its authority and the limits of the right to record in public. Citizens may file a lawsuit against police under [music] Section 1983 if their rights are violated. Officers who violate those [music] rights could face financial liability and may also be subject to discipline or termination. A civilized society [music] is not built on confrontation, but on understanding, responsibility, and mutual respect. Hey everyone. What do you think about this situation? [music] If you enjoyed the video, don't forget to like, subscribe, and support us with a donation. Thank you so much. >> [music]