Well, now it's just, you know, with the prison right there, kind of when somebody's just walking around and they see him videotaping and taking pictures, it just kind of starts making people a little nervous and they consider it suspicious. Okay, well, I need your ID. Uh This is public property where I'm standing. Okay. Have you been here all this time? On public property? >> Were you ever inside the property at all? Nope, not once. Okay. Are you running your body cam? They demand your ID like it's an order. Yet they can't even explain which law actually allows them to do it. I don't know why. I mean Well, I mean, for all they know, you could be over here scouting a location to plan a prison break. I think if I wanted to do that, I'd just use Google Earth. Well, yeah. It'd be a lot less And when police don't know the law, but still try to escalate things, the one who ends up in trouble isn't just the citizen, it's them. A man was standing by the roadside filming a few shots of a prison in the distance. But what no one expected was how fast the police showed up. Walking straight toward him and demanding something that instantly made the air go cold. All right. Have I done something wrong? Well, now it's just, you know, with the prison right there, kind of when somebody's just walking around and they see him videotaping and taking pictures, it just kind of starts making people a little nervous and they consider it suspicious. So. Okay. I just wanted to see your ID so I can know who I'm talking to. You just call me good citizen. How about that? >> Just call you good citizen? Okay, well, I need your ID. Uh I got I got to verify who you are and make sure you're not a prisoner or anything like that. My only interest in the prison is to take pictures of it. >> My only interest in the prison is to take pictures of it. >> You want to add why? How often do you see prisons? I'm not from here, so >> No, I don't I understand. Like I said, it's just one of those things that kind You can catch people's attention and and I just don't know why. I mean, it's just walking around. For all they know, you could be over here scouting a location to plan a prison break. I think if I wanted to do that, I'd just use Google Earth. Yeah. Yeah. It'd be a lot less There's that, too. You know what I'm saying? Just try to look at it from my perspective. Okay. You know? So, that's why, you know, can I see your ID, please? I I don't want to give my ID. Why? Why would I? Well, see, right now I'm trying to conduct an investigation. Okay. So, I need to know who you are so I can verify who you are. It doesn't matter who I am. Yeah. Well, it does. >> [laughter] >> It It doesn't. It does because I got a call about a suspicious person out here video taping the prison and the people going in and out of it. So, I need to know who you are. Okay. So, therefore, I need to see your ID, please. Am I being detained? Yes, you are. Okay. So, you're saying suspicious activity is Is that a misdemeanor or a felony? Right now, it's just a detention just so I can verify that nothing criminal's going on. Okay. So, what reasonable articulable suspicion do you have that I have committed or I'm about to commit a crime? Because you can't This is a constitutionally protected activity. You can't criminalize a constitutionally protected activity for the purpose of a detention. So, what are you detaining me for? You're suspicious. The police approached with a tone that was calm but dangerous, repeatedly demanding to see his [music] ID under the excuse of verifying for security reasons. After a few minutes of what seemed [music] like a routine check, the atmosphere started to shift and right then it stopped being about keeping things safe and turned into [music] a tense legal showdown. Which is a constitutionally protected activity cannot be criminalized for the purpose of a detention. This is law enforcement 101. Come on. >> Okay, this will go a lot Are you T close Are you T close certified? >> Yes, I am. This will go a lot faster if you just Let me Let me see your ID. I can verify who you are, make sure you're not a threat to anything, and then we can both be on our way. >> Well, no, what you actually want to do is uh get my name and my information so that you can check me for warrants because they already know I'm no threat out here on the highway. And you know I'm no threat out here on the highway. How do I know you're not a threat? I don't know who you are. For all I know you could be a wanted person. Do you know anybody that's just driving by on the road? Do you know who they are? Hm? You see all these cars driving by on the road? You don't know who they are. Are you stopping every one of them and asking for ID? When they're doing violations, yeah. Okay. Well, we we got a problem. Okay. Cuz I am not going to identify myself. Okay. 10-56 be advised. Under pressure to show his ID, the man faced [music] the issue head on and said what most people only dare to think. Some checks aren't really about security. They're about digging for personal information. At that point, the police [music] changed tactics, no longer arguing directly, but instead stalling, keeping him in place, and waiting for someone [music] else to arrive. Cuz he tell you to haul me off to jail? No, as far as, you know, as far as we know at this moment in time you haven't committed any violations of the law. You haven't broken any laws. Yeah. That's why I I don't understand why you know, you're giving me such a hard time just by not identifying yourself. I'm not trying to ID everybody that I talk to. Well, I mean it's policy. It's your policy for your agency is to ID everybody so that you can run them and check them for warrants. I got it. I understand what you're doing, okay? But here's my and I'm I'm just going to be honest with you, okay? The issue is that this is my personal information and in this day and age, you know, the way the government misuses our personal information, I'm not saying you're going to. >> No. No. No. No. Okay, I'm just saying in general you have a citizen has got to be very guarded with what information they give out. You know, if you're not careful, you can you can end up on the terrorist watch list, you know, for taking pictures of whatever, things you can see from the public road. Yeah. You know, which is again, a constitutionally protected activity. No, like I said, the only reason I'm here is just because, you know, it just makes people nervous and they called it in as a suspicious person. Well, the way some of these guys run that stop sign there makes me nervous. >> Oh, yeah. Are you going to sit up there and stop every one of them that does it? >> Oh, we do quite a bit. You stop people that run that stop sign right there exiting the prison? Not exiting the prison, no. >> Yeah, that that is a that stop that stop sign is put there by the county and it's got the stickers on it and everything. So, it's a legit stop sign. >> Well, we catch them running this one and other ones up the street and then I tell them they're going to go into the prison that way. Well, from what I've seen you could sit here and generate a lot of revenue for the city right here just sitting there at that corner. So, how long before the chief gets here? Uh, just a minute. Okay. >> He's on his way. Seeing things that I hadn't seen before. Good. I've been enjoying the trip. Well, I'm glad you're enjoying your trip. Well, I I didn't uh anticipate going to jail as part of my trip. Well, you're not going to jail. I mean Well, we'll see when the chief gets here cuz I've got to tell I'm going to tell the chief the same thing I told you. You're not getting my ID. So, >> incredibly strange happens between now and then, I don't see any reason why you would go to The biggest surprise, the police admit he hasn't broken any law, yet they still [music] try to push things further and what happens next makes the bigger picture start to come into focus as the conversation shifts [music] into some very sensitive territory. Manpower, procedure, >> [music] >> how they handle situations like this and the real reason they're so determined to demand his ID. Like I said, if the chief wants ID, then I guess I'm going to jail because I'll do that. I'm not going to ID. I I feel that strongly about it. Well, I pretty much promise you the chief's not going to take you to jail. >> You got a pretty laid-back chief here. Well, I mean, we're pretty easy-going department. >> Yeah. >> We're small, it's a small town, so How many sworn officers you got? Eight. That's it? Yeah, that's from the chief down. Oh, man. That's why it's so easy to get the chief out on a call like this, huh? Well, he's the only other one on duty with me right now. Is that what y'all typically do? You run run two per shift? Just one per shift? What do you do if you need help? Call the SO? We got sheriff's department, DPS, we got guys that are on call. Still? Something like that. Yeah. Little town like this, I think you should always run at least two. Just my opinion. Just for safety. It would be nice. It would be very nice. >> not in the budget, right? >> Exactly. I understand. I understand. It's just unfortunate that uh the times we live in, you know, cities don't have more funding to do what what they need to do. Mhm. Luckily, it's a pretty quiet little place from what I can tell. I'm probably the most excitement you guys have had in a month. I wouldn't go that far with it. Oh, okay. Today? Yeah. Yeah, we we get the same stuff everybody else does, just not as much of it. Yeah, not as many people, so not as much >> Were you Were you a police officer in Dallas in the metropolitan area? Or you just from up there? Cuz Dallas is hiring. I believe that's the chief. >> Yeah, it is. I can see it. Dallas is desperate for officers. They're like 100 officers short or more. Oh, I know. They uh They're having their own city issues with the city and everything else as well. Yeah, Houston is having similar problems. Uh Dallas, Fort Worth, it's it's everywhere. Lubbock. At this point, the police changed their tone, no longer tense, switching to a softer approach and dragging things out, as if they're waiting for someone with real authority to show up. And sure enough, once the supervisor arrives, things don't go smoothly like you'd expect. Because right then the conversation shifts [music] into a whole different level. It's also called suspicious person and suspicious person. Okay. Is that a misdemeanor or felony? It is a figure it's a stop and ID. The Texas Supreme Court has given us the authority to stop and ID people that we deem suspicious and this is suspicious places. Okay. So, you taking pictures of the prison is a suspicious thing. Texas Penal Code 38.02 says I only have to be detained if I'm lawfully arrested, not detained. Not suspicious activity, not if lawfully arrested. Are you The Supreme Court out weighed the issue. Supreme Court has not ruled that. Yeah. You're talking about Hiibel versus Nevada, which is a Hiibel versus Nevada is a stop and ID state. They have upheld the stop and ID state statute. Texas is not a stop and Actually, it was in New York. Again, a stop and ID state. They have upheld the stop and ID state statute. Texas statute You have to go back to Turner versus Driver, which just came out in February. Maybe. We'll see here in a minute when you put the handcuffs on or or I walk on down the road, whichever comes first. Well, what you want to do, man? Okay. I I have no ill intent here. I'm not here to harm anybody. I'm not breaking anybody out of jail. Okay? I'm just walking down here taking pictures of something I can see from the road that's interesting. I thought. Okay. Okay. So, I'm not trying to get you guys wound up, you know, just taking pictures of the >> point of view? I I understand your point of view, but what what I was telling him, he asked me why wouldn't I ID and I I'll tell you the same thing. This day and age with the way the government misuses people's personal information, put them on terrorist watch lists and all kinds of crazy things. Okay? Citizens have got to be very careful about what information they give the law enforcement. I'm not going to put you in handcuffs, man. I I understand. >> I'm not doing anything to you. I just wanted to see your ID. Can I introduce you? Introduce me? >> Absolutely. I'm not I'm not trying to be rude to you. That's not my intention. I'm just going to assert my right to be anonymous. I I prefer I will give you my first name. My first name is Vic. And so am I free to go? We're done here? Okay, I'll let you guys get back to work. If you want to [music] find me, I'm easy to find. I'm going to be at Dairy Queen here in a little bit. All right. You have a good rest of your All right, you too. In the end, instead of blowing up into handcuffs or an [music] arrest, the situation wraps up in a way most people wouldn't expect. He walks away still holding his ground all [music] the way to the very end. Up next, a man is simply standing on the public street calmly observing and recording, but the attitude from inside the facility makes everything tense in a way that's hard to explain. Is there a reason you're filming our facility? Yeah. And that is? I thought I could hear you over there. It's hard to hear in here. Filming our facility, sir? Yes. What is it? I don't want to tell you. You don't want to discuss it? Okay. Are you aware that You know what? Just stand by. I can >> [laughter] >> What what Okay. >> The atmosphere isn't a full-on confrontation yet, but it feels like the person filming is being watched and informally controlled. Then the police show up, but instead of addressing what the security guard did, they shift the focus to verification and identification, bringing up [music] the same familiar security-related justifications people always hear after sensitive incidents. We don't know you. Good. I'm sorry. I I can't hear you over that. I'm going to step back. How you doing? Good. Did you talk to these people already, sir, by chance? Uh yeah, there was a security guard that came out here on the street and detained me. Okay. A security guard >> Yes, sir. detained me. Uh-huh. You understand that's a crime, right? Private security has no authority off private property. This is public property where I'm standing. >> Okay. Have you been here all this time? On public property? >> Were you ever inside the property at all? Nope, not once. Okay. Are you running your body cam? Yes, I am. Okay. >> Yes, I am. Just checking. You guys got good body cams, I got to admit. I I've seen some of the footage you guys They do pretty good. >> Hey, uh since uh since 9/11 happened, Uh-huh. what they're the apartment is asking us to do is to identify folks that are near the apartments that are videotaping. Mhm. All right? And what we do is we'll just do a uh investigation report >> Okay. Because of that. Yes. All right. Uh What's your name? What's your name? Uh what happens if I don't give it? Are you walking as far as or are you on a vehicle? Something like that. I'm not in a vehicle right here right now. All right. All right. Uh So, are you going to You're going to arrest me? You're going to >> no, no, no, the main thing is I told you you that just to make you understand that I need to do an investigation. Okay? That's Sergeant Rios? Yes, sir. Yes, sir. I do have another unit coming out here. All right, but again, I did explain that to you. Okay? 911 They want us as far as policy goes is just to go ahead and identify people that are out here videotaping at the chemical plant. I I don't have no problem. You're out here. If you're out in public property or whatever you're doing, that's you. Okay? But all right. What's going on as far as the May I ask reason why you're videotaping or anything like that? I mean, walking down the street, you see something interesting, you take pictures of it. That's fine. Yes, sir. Yes, sir. Even though their tone stays soft and they try to avoid open conflict, the conversation is clearly being pushed in a different direction. Like they're trying to turn ordinary filming into a case that needs investigating. And right after that, things start heating up for real. The man zeros in on the one point police hate most, the legal basis for detaining him. I feel the wheels turning in your head, Sergeant. And there's no need to be There's no need to be. All right, sir. I mean, we're we're we're here to protect everybody. You, them, everybody, right? There's no Well, I don't want this to be confrontational or nothing like that cuz it Well, unless you turn it into a confrontation, it's not going to be a confrontation. >> sir. And I'm I'm not confrontational and I'm not armed. >> No, I understand. I have no ill intent. The reason I'm here is the reason I'm talking to you is because of that, okay? Now, because they call this, okay? Obviously, I haven't made contact with them. What I'm going to do is I'm going to get the officer that's going to come here and go talk to them and see what they're telling me, okay? And then we'll take it from there as far as what we need to do. All right, sir. Okay. Well, yes, sir. I'm going to let you know that I was on public property at all times. I have a body camera that has run since before I even got here. So, I can demonstrate that if I have to. So, if they lie to you and tell you anything different than that And and by all means, just like you know once we talk to them, obviously if they tell us something different, we'll get your side of the story as well, and we need to talk There's no story. I just gave you the facts. We need to we need to watch that video that you're saying that you have. By all means, we'll do that, hey? If you like, okay? There's nothing to watch. I mean, it it is just public property. All right. So, I I I can't believe this has been such an extended conversation here cuz Houston PD is is usually pretty good about respecting the rights of individuals to be out here on public property. I understand these guys Like I said, because they called us, we still have to investigate whatever it is that they asking. All right. And And you just did your investigation. No, I haven't. I'll tell you right now, I haven't yet, okay? Okay. All right, sir. Well, I'll tell you what. Uh I'm not I'm not running away. I'm just going to continue to do what I'm doing. And uh I'll tell you I'll tell you what, too, okay? Because I'm conducting this investigation, I am kind of detaining you for the time being until I finish talking to them. So, this is an investigation so far, okay, sir? What starts out looking like a normal encounter gets dragged into this awkward, half-detained, half-not situation, leaving the citizen's rights hanging in the air in a really uncomfortable way. And just when it feels like things are about to go even further, he suddenly changes tactics, where a single sentence could decide whether it ends quietly or blows up into something big. Okay. Okay, so I'm not detained. I am or I am not detained. Until I talk to them, okay? Because of where you're at, okay? You are detained for the time being, all All right. I mean, what's your name, sir? Uh this right at this moment, I'm going to go ahead and invoke my right to remain silent. >> That's fine, sir. I want an attorney present during any interrogation. That's fine, sir. You cannot access any of my personal property or seize any of my personal property without a warrant. I'm not. I'm not here to do that or nothing like that. So, while I'm standing here detained, can I go ahead and continue to take pictures? >> Do whatever you need, sir. Yes, sir. Let me uh You guys have any four days. Can you uh see if we can get the reporting coming to talk to me? I'm out here in front of the apartment. On my phone? I'm a white guy at uh 4000 longer. I went ahead and went up to my little investigation, okay? You haven't broken no law. Like I said, I do still need to talk to you, but uh you have every right not to tell me your name or nothing like that. I'm not going to ask you to say nothing. Okay, sir? Okay. All right. And like I said, uh I tried to explain to you initially the reason why I came up on you, reason why uh department wants us to uh uh ID people that that videotape the plants, okay? And that's the only reason, all right? Uh again, uh that's all. All right, sir. I'm going to be on my way. I'm going to Okay. Again, we do have to uh investigation report, okay, that you were out here videotaping, okay, sir? I mean, whether you want to give us your name, that's fine with me, okay? Uh and If you need a name to put in there, just just put good citizen in there. >> That's good enough. Good enough for me, sir. And by the way, the their property line is actually right where that ditch is. >> Okay. Uh we're we're not going to get into I've already checked it. Yes, sir. >> I've already checked it. >> That's fine. That's fine. All right, sir. All right. Good deal. You be safe, sergeant. You too. All right, sir. All right. Uh I'm I'm headed back that way now. >> Yes, sir. Yes, sir. Yeah. So, I guess they'll call Pasadena PD on me next. >> We're going to We're actually going to do a report. We're actually going to do a report, okay, sir? Okay. Yes, sir. After hours of being detained, the police come back with a conclusion that really makes you think. They admit no law was broken, yet they still want to file an investigation report. What seemed like a small incident ends up revealing [music] something much bigger underneath. Citizens may sue police officers under 42 USC Section 1983 when their rights are violated. Officers found in violation may be required to pay damages and face discipline or termination. When power is exercised based on feelings instead of facts, innocent people become targets of control. Real security must always come with human dignity. Hey everyone. What do you think about this situation? If you enjoyed the video, don't forget to like, subscribe, and support us with a donation. Thank you so much.