How you going, sir? Um, so my understanding, um, >> were you were in the room when the lady when someone was >> holding the gun? Yeah. >> Okay. All righty. >> We're requesting that you and Mutterz, uh, conduct interviews back at the Santa Fe County Sheriff's Office. So, we're uh, this is our crime scene tech. We're going to document the clothes. We're going to have him go change out, take the clothes, and then he's going to follow a deputy back to the sheriff's office. >> Uh, I know you already agreed to talk to us and everything, and that's great. Um, we're just going to go over the rights. She's going to read these to you. Um, as you understand them and just sign an initial and then uh if you read the bottom and agree to talk to us >> as you understand them. Yes. >> On October 21st, 2021 at 1:47 p.m. a 911 call was placed from the Bonanza Creek Ranch in Santa Fe, New Mexico. The western film Rust, starring Alec Baldwin, was in the middle of production when a horrifying accident occurred. Two people had been shot during a rehearsal involving a prop gun. What followed would send shock waves through Hollywood and beyond. This video takes you through the critical first moments of the tragedy, beginning with the 911 call that set emergency response in motion, transitioning into the original body cam footage from the Santa Fe County Sheriff's Department, and concluding with Alec Baldwin's full initial interview with homicide detectives just hours after the shooting. It's a gripping inside look at how the first day of this devastating incident unfolded. From raw confusion on set to the sobering start of a complex investigation. Now we take you to the 911 call that started it all. >> Santa fire any MS. What's the location of emergency? >> Bonanza Creek Ranch had two people accidentally shot on a movie set by a prop gun. We need help immediately. Bonanza Creek Ranch. Come on. >> Stay on the phone with me. We're going to get some help. Okay. Don't hang up. Okay. Hold on just one second. >> It sounds like somebody else is calling for two ambulances. >> We better make good. Everybody should be We need some help of director and our cameraman. Camera woman has been shot. Are they going to take him to the road? So, was it loaded with a real bullet or one? >> We I don't I cannot tell you that. >> Okay. >> We have two injuries from a movie gun shot. >> Okay. We're getting them out there already. Just stay on the phone with me. >> Okay. No, no, no. I'm a script supervisor. I ran >> How many people were injured? >> Two. I that I know of. I was sitting We were rehearsing and it went off and I ran out. We all ran out. They were but doubled over the AD and the the camera woman and the dire and the director. They're clearing the road for you to come back. We're back on the We're back in the town. Take a call and we're back in the western town. >> Is there any serious bleeding? >> I don't know. I ran out of the building. What would you find? I still have to go through these. Okay. Are they completely alert? >> We don't know. I can't. Hello. >> Hi. I have a protocol of questions I need to ask. You can just answer them the best you can. Okay. Are they completely alert? >> Um, yeah, they they are alert. >> Okay. >> What part of the body was injured? >> Yeah. Yeah. Uh, I'm not sure. I'm not in there. >> Fine. Is there more than one wound? >> Uh, I think there's one on on on two individuals. >> One wound on two individuals. Okay. >> Yeah. >> Okay. Okay, I'm sending the ambulance help you outline. I'll see exactly what to do next. Okay. >> Um I'm going to tell you how to stop the bleeding. Listen carefully. Make sure we do it right. >> Um >> we do um we do have a a medic onset. >> Medic onset. They're already doing that, >> I believe. So, yeah. >> Is the bleeding controlled? >> Um see if I'm allowed to get as close as needed around 33. No. >> Where on the set are you guys? >> Let me uh we got one laying down. >> Where on the where on the property are you guys? They can go back. >> We're on the uh now we'll have I could have a van. >> Okay. >> It'll be gate one. Um and I see that we have a van out there so that way we could uh kind of escort you out here. >> Okay. They're getting there as quick as they can. Um >> I just reach help is on the way. Okay. If you can information or if anything gets worse in any way, call the facts for further instructions. >> Got you for them. >> Within approximately 3 minutes of the dispatch, deputies and first responders arrived on the set. Their first priority, secure the area. They cordined off the makeshift church set where both cinematographer Helina Hutchkins and director Joel Souza had been wounded. The deputies ensured no one entered or exited the scene to preserve evidence and maintain safety. [Music] [Music] >> We're going to we're going to eat together right away. Wow. >> Huh? >> On her. >> Corporal, I need you to know who's in charge. Everybody stops what they're doing right now. This is a crime scene. >> Yes. >> Okay. Everybody stops what they're doing. And I need the film secured by whoever's in charge of the [Music] [Applause] electric back. Uh, can I put these guys down? Get get them the helicopter. >> Yes, please. >> Once the scene was secure, sheriff's deputies worked alongside on-site medics and EMS to assess and treat the victims. Hutchkins was stabilized and airlifted to Albuquerquey's University of New Mexico Hospital. Soua was transported by ambulance to Christa St. Vincent in Santa Fe. >> Where's the props guy? >> Where's the props guy at? >> Yes, they're they're taking care of business. What else do you need there? Be chief. Where's my radio? >> It was just here. Thank you. They already cleared the gun. >> Where is it? [Music] >> Got the clear gun. >> Following police protocol, deputies immediately began documenting the scene. They filmed and photographed the set, collected the revolver, and later helped execute warrants to retrieve over 600 evidence items, ranging from the firearm to possibly live rounds, blanks, and spent casings. >> Where is it? It's not here. >> There's one there and there's one there. There's none of them. That's not the Okay. >> I need to know where it is. [Music] You're in charge, ma'am. >> Yes, I am. >> I need to know where the guns at right now. >> Yes. Bro, bro, armor. I need to know where the guns are at. >> At first, there was some confusion among the crew when the detective asked about the location of the live round so he could secure them. Given the tragic incident that had just occurred, this confusion was understandable. Everyone on set was in a state of shock. >> How do I know this is a gun? >> That's the gun. >> Okay, come with me. around. >> Where where are they at? >> I don't know. His name's Dave. >> Do you have those rounds I gave you? >> What? >> They're on the card. >> Are they? >> I don't know. >> Well, who did you give them to? >> I gave them back to you. >> I I'll get them. Following police protocol, deputies immediately began documenting the scene. They filmed and photographed the set, collected the revolver, and later helped execute warrants to retrieve over 600 evidence items, ranging from the firearm to possibly live rounds, blanks, and spent casings. The Santa Fe County Sheriff's Office adhered to well-defined emergency response and crime scene protocols, securing the area, coordinating medical care, preserving evidence, and launching a fastmoving homicide investigation. >> Oh my god. [ __ ] I'm so Are they okay? >> Hey, Santa Fe, we need more units out here. >> I'm haven't been inside. I don't know. >> God. Oh my god. I'm happy. I already I already have yelled out so I just 872. >> Are these the rounds here? >> So, okay. Um, >> you have browns here. >> There should Okay. No. So, this is the one. I'm pretty sure I'm This is it. That's the one. And I Okay. Sorry. >> You're okay. Just relax. Just relax. >> So scared. >> You're all right. Just relax. >> So, here's the box that I got them out of. >> Okay. Right there. Leave them right there. Okay. Just relax. I just need you to I just need you to relax. Just relax. Okay. I just need you to relax. Just please relax. Okay? Just take deep breaths and relax. >> Can somebody get water for her? >> Water. [Music] [Applause] [Music] >> Did the ambulance leave? >> No. >> Nope. The helicopter's here for her. >> Yeah, the helicopter's here for her. Is she [ __ ] Where the [ __ ] are these entry ones? Is she okay? Can somebody tell me anything? >> I don't know anything. I just >> right now I don't know. I'm just trying to secure everything. >> Okay. So, I need to know before I start getting information. She's the armor. Who are you? >> I'm the production designer. >> Okay. Thank you. And you? >> I'm the approach manager. >> Okay. Thank you. >> Yeah. >> I I won't remember your names. I'm sorry. No, >> you're fine. You're fine. Can somebody get him water? >> Yeah, I need to. >> Oh my god. [Music] >> Hi, my name is Shannon. He My husband and I own the ranch. >> Okay. My name is Tim. >> Nice to meet you. >> Okay. So, um >> they should be insured for this. >> Yes. I mean, I'm not worried about the insurance. I'm worried about her life. Oh, absolutely. That's what I'm saying. It >> So, uh >> no movie is worth this. >> Was that shot down when it happened? >> No. >> No. >> What can I do to help you? >> Um we are bringing a whole lot of units here because there's a whole lot of people here. >> Yes. We're trying to clear them out. >> Nope. Nobody's getting cleared out. Everybody is staying where they're at. >> Okay. >> Okay. We're trying. That's what so difficult. We're trying to hold everybody where they're at. >> Okay. >> Okay. Okay. What I'm going to have you do is sit in here. Okay. >> Arrested. >> You're not arrested. The door's going to stay open. Uh since you're the armor, they're going to want to talk to you more than anybody. Okay. >> Can I please have that water? >> Yes. >> Oh my god. >> Just relax. Okay. I'm just trying to There's a whole lot of people here, so I'm trying to secure everybody. >> Do you want me to stay with you? >> You can stay right here with her. >> I will stay right here with you. I will not go anywhere. >> You can leave the door open. You You don't have to do anything. Okay. >> Back you up. [Music] [Applause] [Music] >> Hey, to the med. Hey, Santa Fe. If I could have a unit head to St. V's. We got one shot in the shoulder. Uh, that one's going to St. V's. The Hilo just uh landed and they are trying to get that uh other 41 stable. So, if I could have uh somebody go to St. uh same bees and uh with this uh other subject. trans. >> Yes, ma'am. >> Yes, ma'am. >> Radio the truck down. >> No, not at all. I'm sorry. >> I didn't even step to that. So I got you four people there when the Alex Baldwin the actor is want to pull the trigger. You want me to have him sit tight or >> Yeah, he's going to have to sit tight. >> I have the armor in here. This is all their stuff. I have the gun used in there and I got the two people that were in the room. >> Okay. >> You have all those things back or >> um No. I We know where he's at. We know who he is. >> We just need to stay. Is he in a trailer like a gray block? Okay. All right. So, try to keep him away from everybody. >> Not to talk to anybody. >> Okay. I can I can send him in my unit. >> That's fine. Um, but even if they have a production car, if if you get all the director, get a production car. Sheriff's Office homicide detectives took charge, interviewing key personnel, including Alec Baldwin, First Assistant Director David Halls, Armorer Hannah Gutierrez Reed, and other crew members. Deputies gathered initial testimonies to piece together exactly how a gun declared a cold could discharge a live round. What do you mean? Hey. So, um I have my time. Um >> Alec Baldwin, >> sir. Yes, sir. >> Alec is going to he's going to smoke a cigarette and then he'll sit in his own car. >> That's his vehicle. >> Alec Baldwin. >> Yes, sir. >> Okay. Thank you. I'm good. Thanks. I just drank a Red Bull right before and it's I'm all standing by at the entrance of the creek road coming out. >> Okay, I'm going to stand by. So, if you need to Yes, please. >> You doing okay? >> No. [Music] 65 start rolling towards each direction until we hear from him. >> Lieutenant Lieutenant [Music] >> Oh, I thought you were the lieutenant. Oh, >> I need somebody to check that 41. The armor. She's having a panic attack. I need somebody to check for her. >> Okay. >> The armor. >> Yeah, she's the armor. She's hyperventilating. She's having a >> Hey, can you grab your bag? >> You got to go get that guy. He was here. So, can I come back in? What's that? >> Uh, I got to go get that guy over there and bring him back here so we can >> Where is he? >> He's right there next to the guy with the cowboy hat. He's wearing the the black. >> The one on the right. I'll go get him. Okay. >> Okay. Yes, sir. Thank Thank you. Thank you for helping. >> You guys security location. >> You need security. Is that what you're saying? >> Yes. Just give us one security guard. >> That's it. Okay. All right. >> Uh the gentleman in G. >> Hey, Doc. in my unit. It's the girl in the middle. >> Sir, >> you were in the Yes. >> Okay. I need you just to head that way for me, please. >> Thank you. >> Okay. Nobody else enters. >> Uh we were told by the producers. >> Okay. Hold on. All right. Let me see who you guys are. I don't want too many people here. >> Lawyer and lawyer. >> Okay. Hold on, guys. You can post them wherever you need. >> I don't have any additional security guards. I got one I got to keep. I've got my two guys right here. You can push them wherever you want. >> I'll figure that out. Let me go see what's going on with these guys and I'll be right back. >> These guys are standing by. >> Yep. Thank you. [Music] >> Okay. >> You okay? >> Yes, ma'am. [Applause] [Music] Hey, >> where's that lady that was in charge? >> Guys, I need you guys. [Music] Um, this is Reed, one of our camera operators. He was in the room. Okay. Come here, sir. >> How's it going? My name is Lieutenant Benvitz. >> Can I go to the hospital? >> Uh, not yet. >> Okay. >> Not yet. So, Corporal, we got a a camera operator who was in the room. >> Okay. >> Okay. I It's just hard. We We can't let all people in and out. So, if you I'm going to try to get over here. 63 65 with the [Music] Okay, I'm trying to find the the director, whoever directed us on who was in the room. I'm trying to find her so she could help me out and make sure we have everybody. Okay, >> I can do that. >> Okay, >> I'm the UPM. This is If it's not her set, it's mine. >> So, I can help you. Tell me how I can help. >> Okay, who is this? >> This is our lawyer. >> I'm Lieutenant Benvas. I didn't mean to be rude to you, ma'am. I'm sorry. I'm just trying to secure I'm just trying to secure everybody. And who is that again? >> Benz. >> Benz. No, you're fine. >> So, I have a whole lot of people coming this way. So, I'm sure >> one of our co-producers. >> Okay. >> Um, these two gentlemen right here are Lucas and Marcos. They are my locations peeps. >> Yes. >> Um, a little further down in the white is Shannon. She's the owner of the ranch. >> The gentleman who I was talking to earlier in the brown hat is Brian, the production designer. >> Yes, I met him. Okay. >> I'll be wi with you in a little bit, ma'am. Okay. Let me talk to my guys to secure this area. Corporal, I need somebody on that side to secure. So, we're not going in and out. We're try Everybody pretty much that's in is staying in. >> Okay. I have not started a crime scene lobby because it's still fluid. We still have that HILO on on deck. >> Okay. I don't know. >> One patient still here then? >> One patient's still here. Um, do we have somebody going to the hospital? >> Yeah. 68 is >> Okay. >> Where do you want the other person at? If you could stand on that side and make sure people aren't coming in and out. Everybody that's in stays in. Okay. Here. Also, I have the corporal on that side >> with Sanchez. He's still trying to get the information. >> It looks like we have all the people that were in the room was in the room. >> Okay. Come here. >> Thank you. >> If you could go see that gentleman, Sanchez. [Music] >> Okay. Um, I need you to stay by my unit. >> Okay. >> Um, it's I have the weapon in my truck in my truck. Okay. >> And all the ammunition on that tray. >> Okay. >> Okay. >> So, is it an actual gun? >> Um, it uh Alec Baldwin. He's sitting over there. He shot and then he shot. He got the gun from the armor who I have in my car. Um, she's not under arrest. She's just the her, you know, the armor. So, she's in there. So, if you could help with that. And this will be your entry point right here. Okay. >> Okay. >> On his way over. >> Yep. [Music] >> Hey, I still have those uh charges cuz I just I told him to fix those. >> So, that's the one. >> No. Or fix it here. It's in my unit. But all these Okay. Um this is the This is what she said. This is the one that's empty. This is the one that she said. Do >> you have to know social um caliber size? >> Um it's a 45. I have the dummy rounds right here. It's a 45. Okay. Okay. And we will Let's go this way. >> I have a lawyer here already. >> Okay. [Music] >> Okay. We need a date of birth for the med. >> Date of birth and social >> for me or for her? >> For her. Uh, >> would anybody have that? >> Yeah, give me two seconds. >> Thank you. >> And the name was Helena Hutchinson. Is that correct? >> Uh, Helena Hutchkins. H L >> E N A. >> Here, here, get it for you. >> You got a duck. >> Thank you. >> Yep. [Music] >> So, I have Looks like Alec Baldwin is the one that pulled the trigger. >> Yeah. But I have the armor in my unit. I have the gun. We have Pentes and there the tray has the dummy rounds. >> Okay. Um uh I have Frederick on that side. Uh Pentes is taking care of here. He's going to start taking care of the log. >> I got this down until they get the patient still behind there till they speed up and then I'll put it up. >> Okay. >> Make sure everybody goes to Sanchez. All the personnel that were in there. >> Yeah. >> Make sure he has everybody. Okay. >> Just going to get Sanchez up. There's a lot of people here, too. >> Yeah, I have more people coming. >> She okay? Is she okay? >> She's shaking up. >> I know. That's That's why I called the meds for her. I want her checked to make sure she's not, you know, I think they're testing her level right now. Okay. >> Like these. >> We just need her to do good. >> I'll bring it back. >> Careful. >> Well, yeah. >> As long as she's okay. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> She's already dealing with all this over here. >> She needs to get She needs to be in here, too. >> Okay. >> Let me know if you have any questions about anything. >> Yes. Um, so she told me which guns were I mean which bullets came from from it. Um, I'm going to keep everything else the same. I'm going to keep >> these like these here. >> Uh-huh. >> Those are dummies. >> Okay. Well, I I'm pretty sure somebody will won't be asking about us detective. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> Yeah. So, that's already secured. [Music] Somebody getting your crims. Yeah. Okay. It's cuz I switched my unit. Okay. I got two extra people which helped me out um helping secure this area. I have uh we have people in line to take their information. Um right now uh there is a lot of people here. We like I Okay. So right now I do have the dummy rounds, the armor and the gun secured. Okay. Yes, that's when I grabbed her right away. She was with And we did secure the film. We do have the film secured, which they'll have to go over with you how to use it and all that, but that's that's going to be later down the line, I guess, or whenever. But everything was getting filmed. Okay. Um the Hilo's still on the ground right now. I don't know. Oh, they're still working her. They're still working. It was a through and through through the chest. Yes, sir. Okay. Bye. [Music] Did we uh get a crime scene log for Pentis? >> Did we get a crime scene log for Pentis? I >> I can't find any [Music] Okay, you ladies doing okay? I'm >> just waiting on your green light. I'm I'm to be getting wherever it is that uh people are being interviewed. >> Okay, that's not going to be on us. The detectives are coming. >> Okay, so it's not begun yet. >> What's that? >> The interviews have not yet begun. >> Nope, I have not. Nothing. We just secured the armor. >> Okay. >> We secured the gun and the ammunition. >> Okay. >> That's the only thing we've done. >> That's the only happening right now. >> Yes. And then we are getting all the information all the people that were in the room. >> Okay. >> Okay. I'm going to go check on on the victim >> and then >> I thought you went to the hospital. >> No, she's still here. There's still they're they're trying to stabilize her. >> I will let you know how she's doing. >> I know you guys are concerned. >> Yes. >> So, I'm going to let you guys know. Okay. >> Yes. Thank you. I appreciate that. >> Yes, ma'am. [Music] How you doing, sir? [Music] >> Hey, Doc. Is there any way I can put the air conditioner on for you guys? Okay. >> You guys have a direct [Music] stable. She's She's pretty stable right now. They're Rying her and then they're going to fire up. Okay. Yeah. So, she's alive. Okay. She is stable. She's I mean she's critical but she's stable. Okay. Thank you. >> Critical but stable. >> Yes. Through and through through the chest. What's up, Chief? Sir, >> what's taking so long to do? >> They're trying to stabilize her. We have the medic in there from the med and they're trying to stabilize her. It looks like I just asked. They said they're trying to stabilize her. She's critical. So, but you know that. >> No, I know. Um, just sometime soon. >> Sorry about your blues. I know you're at the >> ceremony. Yeah, >> after the 2021 >> I have 24. >> Thank you. >> What else would we need? Sec. We just got to get now. >> Yes. >> Sanchez, >> where is everybody? >> Where is Where are they? She's here and one of the guys went to the back. This Russell guy, the one of >> Okay, I need everybody right here separated. I thought that's what the corporal told you. Get everybody here separated. >> Okay. Nobody leaves. >> All right. One guy already left to the hospital. That was his uh that was his best friend. I don't know what was. >> See the one that was holding on? >> Yeah. >> No. So, who's your supervisor? You ever seen >> with her and his name? >> I have it. I have his name and his number. >> Nobody get everybody here. Nobody else leave. Sanchez. >> Okay. >> All those people in the back. >> Yes. Everybody. Yes. >> Yeah. That's why I was calling for more units cuz we had people everywhere. >> Need it open. No, I just let him know that I'm trying to load right now. >> It's open. >> Yeah. And you can get a clipboard. Hang on a second. >> Okay. So, she's stable but critical. They're trying to stabilize her so she can get on that hilo. >> Okay. >> Okay. So that she is alive. >> Great. >> But critical >> but critical condition and they're trying to stabilize her so they so they could be comfortable when they get on that he >> Okay. >> All right. Thank you for that. >> Okay. But I will give you uh if you see them taking up to the hilo, that's a good sign. They stabilizer. >> Yes. >> And they're going to fly her out. >> Yes. Okay. >> Anything else? >> I'm going to find you guys. Okay. >> Yeah. No, please do. We'll be here. >> Another question. >> Okay. Um you'll see the detectives are all in unmarked cars. They're going to come in a crime scene van. >> Okay. >> Okay. and they'll when you they get here, I'll give you the lieutenant and >> Perfect. >> Okay. >> Thank you. >> And I'll hand them over to you. >> Thank you. >> Okay. I appreciate. >> Yes, ma'am. She doing okay. [Music] She she he was inside the >> He was inside. >> Yes. Do >> you mind if we move her to another vehicle? I think Kevin having her sitting back car intensive. >> What kind of car? If you get a car right here where we could watch her. >> Yeah. >> Um because as soon as the detectives get here, they're going to >> No, I understand. >> Okay. So, if you get another car >> elevates uh that I asked her, that's why I asked her, you know, I just wanted her in one place. I didn't want her to piss out and fall down. No, I understand. Okay, we'll get another car. >> All right. [Music] >> I'll be with you. >> Person. >> Okay. Yeah. So, we're going to talk to everybody here in a sec. We're we're getting these guys treated. We're securing the scene and then we'll get we'll get with you guys in a sec. It's their safety, their medical priority first. Can you guys step right over here? [Music] >> How's it going, sir? Um, so my understanding, um, >> were you in the room when the lady when someone was >> holding the gun? Yeah. >> Okay. All righty. Um, >> what do you need? Well, I know your name, so it's it's uh um >> call you back. Okay. Victory. >> Let me get with my lieutenant and see see where we want you to where we want you to hang out. Okay. >> Whatever you want to do. >> Yes, sir. All right. Give me just a second. >> She said to me an empty gun when we're ready to shoot. It already was prepped. Earplugs, everything. >> All righty. Mr. Baldwin, um who's the director on scene? >> The guy that was shot. >> The guy that was shot. Okay. We're announcing. >> Do you guys have a a production car or >> There's an ad. >> Name is Dave. I'm waiting for you right now. >> I'm happy to stay right here and do everything. >> Well, my lieutenant just want you to to stay away from everybody and not to talk to nobody. So, um I was wait. >> We can wait right here and have everybody step back or we can wait in the back of my petroleum, but I prefer to not put you there. Okay. >> You want something? You want water or something? I want to find props to get a cigarette from you. >> I got What do you got? You got medium armor? Take it. [Music] Uh, as of right now, her her her status is questionable. That's why we called the air light. Are you doing okay? >> No, I'm not actually. >> Okay. Yeah. Um, crazy series of events. So, um, we're requesting that you and MSQA uh, conduct interviews back at the Santa Fe County Sheriff's Office. Um, yeah, if and if an associate to do what to do. >> Um, we would appreciate that. And then we'll >> When do you want me to do that? Uh, we're going to probably go right now. >> So, can I take my car? That's my car. Go back to the base camp. Get rid of the wardrobe. Get my clothes and stuff. Then I'll follow you. >> Yes. Um, I think No, that's okay. Um, I think we might I I don't know if this is suspected blood or real blood. Oh, >> this is fake. >> Fake. Okay. >> Um, theatrical from me. >> Okay. I'm going to talk to our crime scene technician and and see what she had uh suggest or would like. Um >> in the interest of time, can I get in my car, go back to the base camp, give them everything, put my street clothes on and gather my stuff, and I'll be down at the base camp waiting for you. >> Okay? >> They know where my trailer is, and I'll just wait for you. I mean, I'm going to do whatever you tell me. >> Okay? >> So, uh uh let me know. I'll be down at the base camp. I have a trailer there. Let me give them the wardrobe back, put my street clothes on, gather my personal items, and then I'll be down there in that car, and you tell me where to follow you. I'll go right away. Is that okay? >> Yeah, that sounds good, sir. >> That sounds good. >> And we're going to go talk to these right now cuz we're going to request the same information. I'm going to ask uh the the armory specialist or um she's a little uh shaken up. So, um Marissa's right here. if we can photograph your clothes and then we'll get you down to the trailer and get you changed and on your way. Sir, >> you can hold them down just a little bit. Um, do you mind setting your phone down? >> So, we're uh this is our crime scene tech. We're gonna document the clothes. We're gonna have him go change out, take the clothes, and then he's going to follow a deputy back to the sheriff's office, >> and talk to them if he wants, and we'll go from there. Okay. >> Press isn't in here yet, >> right? Not. >> No, she's with us. >> Um, I'm just I'm going to do the back of the >> Could you hold on one second, please? How long have you guys been filming so far? >> Two and a half weeks. Two weeks. >> Okay. >> No, two and a half weeks. >> And you're set for how long? >> Halfway through. Okay. >> Yes, sir. You want to get in your >> This way. >> Yes. >> Thank you. >> So, Miss uh Mr. Jonah, we're going to have him go back to his trailer. >> He's coming with me. >> Yep. and she's going to follow you, Miss Marissa. She's going to uh take his clothes and then he'll change out and then if we can get him to the sheriff's office. >> After the most urgent actions were addressed, investigators began conducting in-depth interviews with all witnesses and key individuals involved. This included Alec Baldwin, the film's armorer, the assistant director, members of the camera crew, and anyone who may have handled the firearm or witnessed the incident. What follows is the full initial interview with Alec Baldwin >> for that reason also. All right, I'll call Carmen on her iPad. Okay. >> Okay. Yeah, she's on her she's on her phone. I'm very sorry. I >> You have no idea. You have no idea how unbelievable this is and how strange this is. And I'll explain to you later. >> Sorry you're in this position. I hope everyone's okay and that you're okay. Uh, I'll call you back. Thank you. Bye-bye. [Music] >> Hi, Samantha. [Music] All right. So, no way you're here uh for this incident that was unfortunate earlier page. >> Yeah. >> Uh I know you already agreed to talk to us and everything and that's great. Um we're just going to go over the rights. She's going to read these to you um as you understand them and just sign an initial and then uh if you read the bottom and agree to talk to us >> as you understand them. Yes. >> Yes. So first one, you have the right to remain silent. Anything you say may be used against you in court or other proceedings. You have the right to consult with an attorney before making any statement or answering any questions. And you may have him or her present with you during questioning. You may have an attorney appointed to you to represent you if you cannot afford one or otherwise obtain one. Um, if you decide to answer any questions now with or without a lawyer, you have the right to stop questioning at any time or to stop questioning for the purpose of consulting a lawyer. >> So my only question is am I being charged with something? >> No, we're justing that's I'm not worried because I'm not Yeah, >> we we have our job at just tell me >> at advising you right here is investigation. Yeah, >> just a phoneality. I have to do it. You're here. You do whatever you have to do. >> What is today? >> It is the 21st of October. >> Long day. >> Well, what's interesting, not to digress on some commentary here, that we've done this for two weeks and we did it the right way. Every day. Every day. You're on a set, you rehearse, they bring you what's called a cold gun. The gun is either completely empty the chambers or there is a cosmetic piece. So, for example, if you're the camera, and this is going to sound silly and specific, but if I'm pointing a gun close to the camera, you want to see into the cylinder that there's material in there, cosmetic material. So, those rounds are cosmetic rounds. >> They put them in and you rehearse or even in a shot when you don't fire. I pull it up and you see there's some material inside the cylinder. They'd hand me a cold gun, no charges. They always hand you a cold gun with nothing in it to rehearse. And then when you shoot and if you are shooting loads that are flash loads and they're usually in three denominations, quarter, half or full load round so that the flash is bright and the sound is loud, louder, loudest. Full load is loudest. So if you're outside, you want a full load bang. You want a loud sound? They're inside. You put a recorder on them. Right before you shoot, everyone preps. Crew puts the earplugs in, so put headphones on. The camera's there very often. There's a loose sight screen, but you're the camera operator. And there's the camera. So, I shall always shoot off camera. You never shoot into the lens. And you shoot and there's a flash and a sound. Now, I went to lunch. She disarmed me. I sat down. you being >> uh Hannah, the the armaments person, >> I when she was always handling the guns or 99% of the time. >> So I would uh if I had a cosmetic rifle with no rounds that I handed to one of her assistants. I'm sitting there, she disarms me, we go to lunch, we come back for lunch, and they hand me the the revolver, the the Colt, >> and they I just like the name. again. >> They they arm me >> and you're assuming as we've done every time that it's a gold gun for the rehearsal >> and I put the the the gag in the shot or the camera is I have a coat and I have a holster and I pull the coat over and I kind of cup my hands like I folded my hands >> and then I'm going to slowly sneak the revolver the colt out and turn and shoot these other guys or try to shoot them. I take the coat over the thing. I the camera's there. I believe my recollection is she was there turned a bit like talking to him. So her I think she was hid in the right armpit but this is all I know and that is that I take the gun out in the rehearsal where he wants it very dramatic and very kind of sneak up on them. I take the gun out and as I take like as it clears the barrel clears all turn and [ __ ] the gun and rehears I turn and [ __ ] the gun. The gun goes off. >> It's supposed to be a cold gun. Nothing. No flash charges. Nothing now. This is a puzzle to me and this is making me very emotional now, you know. But in my time, and I'm older now, but when I was younger and I was shooting guns in the field, I've never seen a theatrical flash round with the material went through someone's armpit came out their body and hit somebody else in the shoulder. >> I'm wondering if your department is prepared to go find out what comes out of his shoulder surgically. Is that a live round? >> That's what we are actually looking at. Is that a lot? Cuz I don't. It doesn't make any sense otherwise. >> Really? Yeah. >> It hits her in the armpit, comes out her shoulder, goes into his shoulder, and he just told me on the phone. I talked to Joel. He said, "They showed me the X-ray and the shape of the thing in my shoulder is the shape of a bullet." Now, all the rounds I was told, you need to verify. I think this is an important. They take the gun, they enter, and all the rounds that are in there were either dummy rounds, no flash, cold rounds, or rounds with a flash. In the rehearsal, there should have been nothing. It should have been a cold gun with no rounds inside or dummy rounds, cosmetic rounds, no flash. I take the gun out slowly. I turn. I [ __ ] the pistol. Bang. It goes up. She hits the ground. She goes down. He goes down screaming. He's like, "Jesus." And I'm going, "And I thought that maybe sometimes the wading can come out if you're causing you a burn. two actors who killed themselves with guns, the theatrical guns, John Eric Hex and Brandon Lee. They put the live round and I'm told even with the flash powder, you can cause contusions and you can do a blame brain bleed and die which both of them died. >> Right. >> I think with Brandon Lee there was a a piece of material lodged in the thing that shot from the something. >> Yeah. I don't remember vividly, but my point is I've been doing this. I shot enough guns in my day in movies. I've never seen this before where a flash round was. But from my understanding is Can I borrow your pen? >> You could even borrow me. >> My my understanding is that in a in a in a bullet, you know, here's the thing with the pin and here's the the bullet itself. or here when you have a cosmetic round, no flash, no nothing, they drill a hole in the side of the brass to show to signify that it's a cosmetic round. There's nothing in there. There's no powder. And but when you have a when you have a flash round and you have and there and there's stuff in there, wadding and powder to make the charge. This material here that is the bullet is made of a clay or some material that just disintegrates. So, what you have is bang, and you see the flash go bang, and you hear a sound, but nothing. There's no projectile. >> Mhm. >> And what I'm curious about is what came out of that bullet that went through her body and into his shoulder. >> That's pretty powerful. >> I've never heard it. Now, some people say you can lodge material in the barrel, accidentally, a rock, something that happens, which is why she, every time we've done this, I'm here to tell you to testify that every time we've done this, she done it right. She cleaned the barrel and so nothing was lodged in there. We went hot when they were ready. You're always announced going hot. Crew gets ready. And then all of a sudden you're the camera and I shoot away from you. I sit there like bang bang bang and flashes are coming out. We shoot the rounds. She cleans the barrel every time and she checks that the rounds are all cosmetic rounds for or nothing in the chamber for the rehearsal. She hands me the gun. I'm assuming she's done it the right way. She's done it the last two weeks. I put it in the holster. I pull it out slow. We're rehearsing. We're not filming anything. I pull it out slow, turn, [ __ ] the pistol, bang, it goes off, and she hits the ground. And then he starts screaming. And I'm thinking in a flash round, I could see maybe if there was wading or there's some stuff like that's hot and maybe it hit you and burned you. As they say, sometimes that happens. But remember, we're rehearsing so no one's protected. >> So, it's all supposed to be this one cosmetic one. or nothing. For the rehearsal, the gun is normally empty. >> Mhm. >> But my point is is that >> they were standing in positions they wouldn't ordinarily be in cuz they assumed it was an empty cold gun. We weren't shooting. We were rehearsing. That's the vital difference. So if she's here, if the camera's here and she's standing here talking to the gun and I'm on a bench here and Joel's behind her and this guy, this is not proportionate because obviously the camera is not as big as her body. And I draw the gun slowly and aim off camera and there's supposed to be nothing in there. So she's not protecting herself and standing off. I'm shooting in a direction and everybody is supposed to be to that side of the camera. There's nobody in my line. Nobody. And so when I shoot the gun, so when the rehearsal I'm assuming I have an empty gun and the gun goes off, she's right in front of me. >> She's as far from me as I am from between difference between maybe you and the door. >> Okay. in close proximity. >> It was a very It was a very tight shot. >> Okay. >> The shot was here of me. Not of me. It's of me pulling the gun slowly. Turn [ __ ] >> Okay. >> And she's right there vulnerable in a position she wouldn't ordinarily be if we were shooting and and this thing boom, she hits the ground. >> Okay. >> All right. I'm going to back you up just a little bit. Okay. >> How long have you been on site? >> I arrived uh Monday the 11th. >> Okay. >> And started my fittings and my they were already were shooting the week before >> and the 11th of October. >> Monday the 11th I flew in from New York. I flew from New York to Denver, Denver to Albuquerque because there no direct flights here and then drove from Albuquerque to here. Rehearsed and fitted and did all my preparatory stuff. >> But that was in October, correct? >> That was Tuesday the 12th. Yeah. I flew on the 11th, rehearsed on the 12th, started shooting the 13th. Wednesday the 13th I started shooting. >> Okay. >> We shoot a Wednesday through Sunday schedule. We're all Monday, Tuesday. >> So, the entire time you've been on set, have you seen the same armor >> and her crew? Yes. >> Everybody. >> How many people are on her crew? >> Uh, my guess is that what I witnessed is three. >> Okay. >> All young women. Hannah and two other women. >> All right. And very often their task with me because we're not shooting every day guns. We're not there's no armaments every day. They dress me with my holster, my knife. We're the film is set in 1888. So I'm armed with the classic weaponry of the cowboy era. >> Okay. >> And so they would make sure I was dressed properly. You know, 80 85% of their task is to make sure I'm dressed with everything properly. >> The armorers. >> The armor. Well, the armorers wardrobe doesn't necessar they sometimes trade back and forth, but wardrobe doesn't necessarily deal with my holster, >> okay, >> and and the knife, but that's a prop. The armorer, Hannah, and her team, they dealt with me being knifed and not being lashed properly, so it looks proper. >> Okay. >> And the uh holster. >> Okay. And >> so wardrobe as much as it was props as much as it was armaments. >> Okay. Do you know Hannah's last name? >> No. >> Do you know what she looks like or can you describe? multicolored hair, glasses, uh you know, uh not too tall. Everyone knows her pretty well cuz her father is a very famous armament guy. He's a guy that did guns in movies for decades. He's very well known. >> Okay. >> She's the daughter of this famous gun guy, movie gun guy. >> And what about the other girls in her crew? >> I don't remember their names. >> Okay. Do you know what they look like? >> A blonde, thin, not too short, you know, kind of medium height. and brunette. Someone on the shorter side, maybe the same height as Hannah, brunette, and uh and also there's a there's you go back and forth between they're wearing a mask most of the time on set order to do that, but I've seen them with their mask off. >> Okay. All right. What time did you guys start today? >> I don't know what time they started. I came in slightly later cuz they had a couple of shots without me in the morning. So, I came in at uh I guess I arrived there at like about4 to 8. >> Okay. >> Normally, I'm there at like 6:30. All right. And then anything abnormal in the day? Who handed or should I say who handed you your weapon in the day? >> Hannah. >> Handed it. Okay. And physically handed or put it in the holster. >> Hand it to me. >> Okay. >> She would show me the gun. >> Okay. >> Or she'd say coal gun. She'd say test it or some language to indicate as she handed me the gun. Then it was fine. And she say do you want to check? >> And I always want to went self- arrested because we never had a problem. Yeah. And >> I said, "I'm good." So, and the first AD very often will ask periodically. He'll say, "Let me check." >> Okay. And they'll have two people check for this very reason that we don't have any FL forget about live rounds of bullets that we have any flash rounds in the gun while we're rehearsing because if someone wants to indicate and and they've got thinking they pull the trigger on the gun you just hear the hammer the the the dead sound of the hammer hitting and and you have no flash rounds at all in there for the the rehearsal gun should be empty. >> Okay. >> And and and as I said for the two weeks I've been shooting it has been empty. We haven't had one problem. >> And you have you physically checked that or just by >> she announces to me that it's that's that's clean. >> Okay. >> She'll say cold gun. We rehearse. Then when she's done, she takes the gun, goes off to a corner. She has a kit like a zip fanny pack with her uh elements in there. She puts the flash rounds in there. She'll say, you know, uh uh quarter load, but you know, it's it's a lower sound. Or she'll say full load. If I'm shooting, if you're the crew and you're shooting me close, even if I say the full load, it is rather loud. It's very loud. >> Okay. >> So, she's always announcing what's going to happen. >> All right. >> She's been very good about that. >> So, have you guys backtracking a little bit on this? Um, you know, cuz she's telling you what's in these guns. Um, have you guys been practicing with those quarter loads, the full loads, all that through the past couple weeks? Or have you shot with them? >> I came in on Tuesday. That's what I did. Tuesday. Okay. the 12th I came to the ranch, rode the horse. I just got used to that and cuz they have a double who really rides in the distance up really fast and all the athleticism you see on the horse and they cut to a watch. I have another guy riding as a horseman. Okay. >> We have quite a crew of them. >> So today was not the first day that >> No, I shot on Tuesday the 12th with the uh uh the Henry the the lever uh you know arm action lever the lever action rifle. Okay. And the disc I just shut off both. >> Okay. And >> but she was there. >> All right. Moving back forward. What time did you guys break for lunch today? >> Usually I think today was able we broke at 12:30. >> Okay. And who took the weapon at that time? >> Hannah >> physically took it. >> Always knows. >> Rarely do the other ladies, the two other women handle the pistol that were that's live shooting in the scene. As I said, I have the Henry in my hand. as a prop. I'd be running through the scene, but no, no bullets, nothing. When they'd say cut, I could hand it to the blonde girl. >> Okay. >> But whenever we were interacting with somebody where rounds were going to go in the gun, you would have flash rounds in the scene. We shot flash rounds. It was only Hannah. Only >> with her fanny pack with the rounds in there, her equipment. >> Okay. Um, do you know what time you guys got back from lunch? >> My guess is 1:30 by the time we all get back to the setup. Uh there's a base camp and there's the set. >> So we go to the base camp for lunch and they always drive back, get their wardrobe touched up, get their hair touched up and makeup, whatever we do, and then we're on set about an hour before we were back on the set. >> Okay. And was Hannah the one to physically hand you the gun at that point? >> Okay. Um during the time that you had it, was it ever handed off to anybody else? >> No. Okay. Did you see where she got the gun from? >> No. >> Okay. Um, >> she has a station somewhere with all her stuff. >> Okay. >> The elements and a gun. A couple different guns. Guns for the other actresses. She was holding guns. >> Is anybody else allowed in that area? >> I don't know. But I know that on the I've never seen anything that was out of the ordinary. She had like a sometimes they have a a cart like almost like you use like a hospital catering and like a big plastic tray, a dark plastic tray, two levels and wheels. I think that's what she has, but many of the departments have that. And on that tray would be her or something like that. I don't recall what exactly hers, but they have a station that they bring to the set, okay, for her to put all of her stuff. and uh uh if the weather is cooperative and sometimes they put it under a tent if it's looks like it might rain that way and damage the property. But uh she has a little place she would go to and I think she has a truck where she stores when they wrap everything goes into a truck and she takes off with it. It's her responsibility to to uh secure the prop weapons >> everything in there >> which are real guns. They're real guns. >> Um can you actually describe the gun to me? >> Uh it's a cult, a period cult. uh in our emails back and forth when we were prepping the film, she showed me just a couple different styles of guns. This is not a big budget movie, so we didn't have a lot of choices. You know, you you she showed you three or four choices. I said, "Give me the biggest gun you've got." >> Okay. >> And uh uh and so I didn't uh she showed me different guns uh by email and different knives by email. Uh crudder knives that were made to like someone fashion the handle out of like el corn or things. I took a traditional knife, a leather strap, a handle. Um, we went back and forth about the holster and the material and, uh, we just had a a relatively brief conversation. I I'm having made a lot of movies, I know how not to stress them out about the budget. When she shows me something, I try to make that work. And so, uh, she showed I said, "Just give me the big cult when we're done." And then on that Tuesday, the 12th, I came and shot that gun. >> Okay. What color is it? Uh, I believe it's a brown handle cuz she showed me two of the larger coats. One had a cherry colored handle and one had a brown handle and I chose the brown handle. >> You didn't want the cherry. >> I could show you my emails in my I didn't want the cherry. It was too shiny. >> Ah, okay. >> My character is a little bit in the retirement side of his career. So, >> he's a retired bank robber. >> I'd say out in the Wild West match. >> Well, you always have people in films. I mean they go to extensive extent. You wouldn't believe some films if they have the budget. The details you go into of all the things you wear, jewelry, hats, watches, guns, cars. I mean you people sit down. I mean I've made a lot of films and the films that had bigger budgets. You could spend a whole week going to rehearsal reading with the director. The writer goes and rewrites. They listen to how the dialogue sounds and then once you're done rehearsing the text with the director, the producers and the writer when you're done reading they'll go make amendments. When they hear it come out of your mouth, they go, "Let's change that line." The way Bob says that, and then they go, they go, then you go right to wardrobe props. You go do a lot of stuff. >> Okay. All right. So, you come back from lunch, get ready, she hands you the gun. Um, was this inside or outside? >> We said the church. The church set. >> And was it the first rehearsal that the incident happened? >> Yeah, I believe so. because we talked about as we were going to lunch, we're always talking about what's next. >> Okay. >> So, as we were rehearsing scenes, he said, "Now, I want to do a scene where we've done other shots before lunch." He said, "When we come back from lunch, we'll do this." And he said, "Okay, pull out. Show me." Cuz I was showing you what I thought was the best angle to see the glint of the gun under my coat. Cuz you want the scene to work, the shot to work. So, where the holster's here, if the gun is here, my coat comes around. And I held my hand like it was like I was just cupping my hands like I was just resting. >> Okay. >> And I showed him in the rehearsal. So when we came back after lunch, we rehearsed for the camera and I took the gun and I really I'm showing him. I'm going I'm going to go like this, like this, like this. The [ __ ] and turn. Bang. It went off the first time. >> Okay. So it was it was your >> It was the very first time that we were shooting that shot that we were rehearsing for that shot. >> Okay. >> That camera shot. Um, and you may if you don't know this thing, did you happen to see So, obviously you guys left from that upper your upper shooting area to go have lunch or did you eat lunch at there? >> No, we always go back to the base camp for lunch. Okay. >> For the stage. >> Did the armorers or did you see the armorers go down? >> No. >> No. >> Nor would I? >> Okay. >> Well, once they're gone, I'm gone. >> Okay. Do people stay up on set or does everybody go down? There are many people who will forego lunch. >> Okay, >> I say that back. Not many. There are some who will forego lunch because they have work to do. >> Some will hold them a plate. Someone will go bring their own lunch because many people they uh um they make sacrifices because of their pride for their department. >> They may sit there and say, "I think I need to paint that wall and touch up that wall. I think I need to distress those boots." They all have work to do. And very often a small number of people will stay up top while we drive down from the set to the base camp. The caterers there in need, but maybe a modest number of people stay up there. >> Okay. >> All right. And then I just want to clarify really um I know you were drawing something. All right. So when you had pulled out the guns, obviously you were not at the cameraman, but you had identified there were two people there. Can you tell me who those people were? >> My recollection is that the operator was there. He's the steady cam operator. >> Okay. He's a man who there's either a camera on sticks that's stationary or there's a man who operates the steady cam that moves. The camera operator was there behind the camera and she was to his right. >> And who is she? That's the one who >> the the cinematographer. >> Okay. >> The camera director >> and she was right next to the cameraman. >> She was to his right to my left. >> And who is behind her? >> Joel. and he is >> the director of the movie. >> Okay. >> Can you recall who exactly was inside at the time of the incident? >> Uh Dave Halls. >> Okay. >> The first AD. He's in charge of the crew. The first assistant director is the man who's like the foreman of the set. He's in charge of all the grips, all the all the crew. >> Okay. Electric, cable. >> Do you know who? >> Dave Walls. Dave Halls. >> Oh, good. Dave, >> Dave Halls is always there. Uh, Helena, Joel, me, the operator, an assistant camera person, the script supervisor, the woman who sits in the corner in some strategic position to take notes on all the action of the take so you can batch. If one day you're doing a scene, you sit there and go, "What is your first name?" >> Samantha. >> Samantha. Like, Samantha, you know, it's really important that you and I drink, drink, drink, get together and talk about that case. You drank. When did you She makes notes. So, we match every take. That's called continuity. That woman who does continu, she's always there watching. She was in the room. >> Okay. She's an older woman like in her 60s maybe with um like colored blonde hair maybe or brown hair but she I forget her name now but she's so there's a group of people that are always there for every shot even if you're in a kind of a cramped interior this set of this church is not large so then the rest of the crew is outside and that's was a limited number of people maybe eight n I don't remember but I know that every time we do a shot those people are always on the set camera assistant camera, cinematographer, director, a first ad script. >> Okay. So, not too many. >> Very few. >> Do you think that any part of this incident that occurred was intentional? I I can only say this, which is in other words, to me to place a bullet and position a bullet that is a live round to make sure that that bullet is in the chamber. If I were to squeeze the trigger in a rehearsal, that that bullet came out. Someone has to have extraordinary access to that weaponry to do that. I can't imagine somebody walked around with a round that was a 45 caliber round. So you see other people on the set were speculating that if it was a 45 caliber round, she'd be dead. It would have blown a big hole in her. And so we're wondering was the projectile that went in her some foreign material stuck and it was an accident. It was a flash round and something came out of the barrel. They didn't check. They always check. But >> to your experience with these armor, >> I've never heard of anything like this in my life. Ever. >> Okay. I've never heard of a projectile coming out of a prop gun that went through a person's body and regardless of it being a smaller woman that that the bullet went in here, I'm told, went in here, came out here, her shoulder or whatever, and went into his body and very I've never heard of that in my life. I don't know of any projectile in a gun in a flash prop gun that could accomplish that. Now, if somebody put a live round in there accidentally, see a very important question for Hannah is, do have you ever co-mingled live rounds with theatrical rounds in your kit because they're forbidden to do that. >> Mhm. >> According to I think the union rules and the safety rules for all the unions, you're not allowed to do that because of the fear of what would happen that you coingle. So whether someone accidentally and I can't even imagine this deliberately placed a live round in that gun. Uh I've never never heard of that in my life and I don't know anything about what happened. But all I know is when I see See the other thing about this is in a live round you have a recoil. Usually when I shot that gun and it went off I didn't shoot it when it went off. Um, I didn't intend for it to to to for what happened to happen when that happens is it I'm always told but because I'm not a gun person. I don't own a gun. They've always told me they asked me to simulate the recoil when I shoot the culp which is a big gun 45 caliber bullet. They always teach me when we shoot go action. I go get back here. Boom. And they make me take my hand and go boom and have the kick >> because there's no kick in a flash round. >> Okay. >> And when I this happened I don't recall there being any kick either. That's important. Okay. Are you I know you said you don't own a gun, but are you experienced with shooting guns? >> Only as much as actors have to be experienced. >> Okay. Which is normally not really >> I mean if you do a movie safety with weapons is is primary. You go off with people. You go off with armaments people to ranges. I've gone to ranges in Arizona where we shot a lot of guns in a movie many years ago. And uh you go to a range and you shoot for a few hours and they teach you how to shoot shotguns uh Walther uh uh different you know little small guns uh James Bond guns big guns uzies machine guns whatever you're using they make you go and rehearse for hours a whole day >> okay >> yeah they're very safety conscious as they have been here they've been very safety conscious here throughout what puzzles me Yeah. And I guess that's more like the question that I'm trying to get out is do you think someone would deliberately do this? >> I can't imagine who would. >> Okay. >> Now, people have said, you know, that six people got fired from the crew yesterday because they said that the, you know, the union, I don't want to get into a long diet trap about this, but the union, the International Association of theatal Stage Employees, IATSI is their name. IATSI is the union that controls all the actors. The director's guild controls the director. the screen actors, but all of the crew are controlled by a contract in which those people voted to go on strike against the major studios, the major networks, the major streaming services, but not the independent film community, in fact, the IATSI rep for the New Mexico contract, because every state has different contracts, was instructed by his bosses in LA, he said, "Don't go on strike. The strike is against the majors, not against the indie people." And in the indie films, there's six different tiers, I believe, in terms of the contract, how much they're paid. >> Okay. >> A bunch of people on the set walked off anyway, even though they were told not to to to strike. They they struck and they left. >> And that was yesterday. >> That was yesterday. That was their last day. And the question becomes, I mean, somebody said, would would one of them do I I don't I don't really know. I I have no idea. I have no idea. Well, and it was because that was mentioned to me is that it sounded like it was most of the camera crew that walked off set >> um yesterday and quit and maybe they got fired because they walked off. Um so the other thing is that the two major people like you said the director um those are the ones who got hurt. So, with the camera crew and them quitting and then your director getting injured as well as um Helena, you don't think there's anybody that had any anger towards them or anything that would >> I don't know the details. I know that one guy whose name I'm forgetting, he was a very heavy set guy. >> Okay. >> He was a very and lovely to me and he walked up to me and he said, "Thank you for the things you posted on social media in support of the IAZI strike." And he said, "I'd like to talk to you privately." Cuz he said, "Cuz I've got some of my guys sleeping in their car." >> Mhm. >> Many of the crew here because it's shooting in Albuquerque and Santa Fe or Albuquerque based. They live there. So the drive time uh it's kind of common knowledge in the business that the uh the unions in New Mexico signed very bad deals in order to attract movie shooting here. They wanted to grow the the the crew uh uh base here. So they signed the deal that wasn't a good deal. when I gave them a 60-mi commute radius. So that means if you live within 60 miles of the set, >> you come to work and you don't get paid any you have to drive home, they don't hotel you. They don't know in New York it's 30 miles and they have to put you open a hotel and give you gas money and there's a whole other complicated contract in the in the more um expensive markets here. This guy would tell me he turned to me goes my guys are sleeping in their car. Now I went to the ad and the producers and I asked him what's up with that. He said they knew what the contract was. We signed the IAI contract in New Mexico and then in the middle of shooting they decided they wanted to rewrite their deal. They said put us up in hotels. Now if you put the camera group in a hotel all the other crafts are going to ask you to put them in a hotel. We don't have the budget for that. That could be $75 $80,000. You know what I mean? >> Who was that man? >> Who you the one who said that? >> I like I forget his name. Okay. >> But anybody there can tell you who the big heavy set guy was who was on the crew that quit yesterday. He didn't come to work today. But my point is that if I'm standing there in a rehearsal, >> I'm thinking to myself, could someone actually believe that in a rehearsal I would actually aim the gun and hit those two people? That's far-fetched. Or do they want this somebody to get hit? Or I keep telling myself more likely, was it an accident? It was a large quarter load is makes noise, but it's like kind of a puff compared, but a half load could shoot a projectile if something was stuck in the barrel. And like I said, the thing that is, I think, going to answer one of your questions is what's in Joel's shoulder? >> Is it a rock or was it a bullet? >> Uh, I could actually show that to you. >> What? >> What was in his shoulder? We did. Did they take it out? >> So, you've been on set for so many years. Like you said, you have you ever seen you you said you never seen anything come out before? >> I've never seen No, I've never seen a projectile come out. No. >> Right. So, >> but do you know what the bullets look like? Would it have looked something like this if anything did ever come out of something? Is that >> okay? No. Okay. >> So, let's backtrack a little bit. Let me say this to you. >> That's a bullet. >> That's a bullet. >> I suspected somebody put a live round in the gun. If that's a bullet that was pulled out of his shoulder, then someone loaded a live round into the gun I was holding. >> So now, let me ask you, did you see the rounds that were in the gun? >> No. >> Have you seen throughout the whole time on set, have you seen what they look like? >> I've watched her load and reload the gun many times. Many times. >> Have you seen the bullets themselves? Well, meaning yes, meaning you see um sometimes the head it's the casing and the head is a pinched. It almost looks like a dumpling. It's closed at the top. There is no piece and you put the cosmetic round in when you know you're going to see if I hold if I say to you, what is your first name again? >> Alex. >> If I say to you, Alex, don't you move a muscle dog and I'm going to blow you the camera shoots me. You want to see the material in the cylinder. The cosmetic claybased nonbullet round. >> So, can you describe to me what those claybased rounds look like? >> They look like a bullet. >> What colors? >> They're the They're gray. They look exactly like a bullet. Brass head and a brass base packed with something, I'm assuming. And the uh um and then the uh the head look like a bullet. So, cosmetically, you see that in the cylinder. The other rounds you shoot have a it's the it's the base with the pin. This comes up and this comes and it's a round like this. And if you look at the top, if you're looking down at the bullet with the where the uh not the pin down here, the top of it, if you look down, it's folded in like a almost like a >> Yeah. Like a dump. >> Like a pinch. >> Exactly. It's like a folded up thing and the chart and all that does is go boom. >> So there's no projectile there. If I showed you a couple rounds, would you be able to tell me if they are the ones that look like they were on set? >> Probably if I think I could probably tell you which were the rounds that were put in cosmetic. >> Okay. >> And which were the rounds that were the flash rounds. >> All right. >> Now, forgive me cuz I'm very upset right now. >> I know. >> You know what I'm saying? So, please take don't forgive my my my weirdness about this. That's what came out of Joel's shoulder. >> Yes. Yes. And the reason why I was showing it because you said you have experience, but you're saying when this does come out, it's supposed to just puff and not really be >> usually >> a hard object. >> If there's any chance, if there's any chance that when you look at the gun, so here's the barrel, here's the sight, and the cylinders around and it has the holes. >> Mhm. >> We're just looking at the gun, the camera's eye view. When you look at the cosmetic rounds go in, they have no flash. If you want to have cosmetic rounds that flash, if you want me to hold the gun, you see the bullets and I shoot, that material is often a clay or, you know, fabricated material that just disintegrates, disturbs the powder. >> And the round that you put that you don't see, you're not seeing down the barrel you're shooting, those are the flash rounds, which has the top that looks like it's like like folded kind of things like this where it's looks like someone's packed it and closed it. But specifically today was supposed to be either empty or the ones that don't even make anything. So cold drum, the one with the hole in it. >> Yes. >> And it's not going to it's not supposed to puff up or powder off like you said. Nothing. >> Halls told me that when he checked the rounds with her, they were all had the holes in them. And some and sometimes he told when I wasn't familiar with this they'll take the round and if it's a cold round it'll have the holes and inside will be BB's and you shake it. >> Yeah. >> When you shake the BB it's an acoustic thing to tell you that's a cold round. >> Okay. And yeah that's so and that's what >> inside this base is stuff that rattles little BBs that rattle. So you're taking that's a cold round. What goes in the gun? >> Okay. And that's what you were supposed to have today. >> I supposed to have an empty gun. >> Empty. or when we shot for the rehearsal empty >> and then when we shot if the flash rounds and everybody preps and then she says hot gun she announces it and the crew gets ready >> but that didn't that you didn't get to that >> I rehearsed with a hot gun now >> but you were supposed to be cold >> and well it was supposed to be cold or empty but now not only did I rehearse with a hot gun I rehearsed with a gun that had a bullet inside if that's what came out of your show this is the most horrifying thing I've ever heard in my life >> well so yeah and that's why I wanted to make sure that you anytime that you've shot a hot gun um you've never seen anything like this come out before? >> Never. >> Because I am not familiar with prop guns. I could tell you what a projectile looks like and that does projectile. >> See that's a bullet. >> Mhm. >> Yeah. So that's what comes out of >> Well, I think the question I mean I don't really want to tell you your job but I'm so sick about sickened by this that a bullet passed through this girl's body. She's in critical condition in a hospital right now and I fired the gun. And you know, if you don't think I feel really really shitty about that, I do. But the question becomes, if you ask Hannah, did you co-mingle live bullets? What they what they call live rounds? When they say live rounds, that's a bullet that a police officer would shoot. >> Where did that come from in her kid? >> Yeah. Um, >> she coingleled live rounds with dummy rounds or movie rounds. And we asked her, we asked her that. Uh, do you know where you guys get the realms from? Who orders it? Or you don't have any part of any of that? >> Who? Me? >> Yeah. >> All familiar. Okay. >> All I know is when we come to the set, you hand me a a cold gun. Nothing's in. We rehearsed. Then we load the gun with the flash rounds and we shoot. That's it. Every time. We've never had a problem. >> You didn't even get part to that second part of you'll hand it back. I do want to ask you about Dave Halls. Um I understand sometimes she'll hand the gun off to Dave Halls and then he'll hand it to you. Did that happen at this incident? I don't recall ever doing it. >> It was Hannah handing. >> I never rec I recall that when we would stop the scene, if we finished a scene, >> Halls is someone who is assumed by his position to be authorized to do nearly everything. >> So if I was doing a scene with you and we finished the scene and we finished your angle and we were going to turn around and shoot my angle, when you when they say turning around, that means it's time to go to the bathroom, go get a bottle of water, go get a coffee, go smoke a cigarette. We have a break. And if I was going to go to the bathroom, I'd hand hauls the gun to give to her. I would only hand it to her or if she wasn't around, if she was if she was away cuz she'd be in the shop. They cleared the hand holds the gun, said, "Give it to her. Give this to to to uh Hannah." >> Sometimes So sometimes you would hand the gun to Hall, but you never um he never handed the gun to you. >> No. >> Okay. No. No. >> But you would hand it to him. I passed it off to him if she was not on site and I was going to want to use the bathroom. But that's very typical. Halls is empowered and authorized to to hand him the weapon. He's the only other person to hand the after we were done. After we were done, whether it was a cold gun with no things or flash rounds, I'd say hot gun, hand it to him or usually not. Cuz usually it was it was a it was a hot gun. If it was a hot gun, we were going to shoot cheapy right nearby. If I hit cuz other times we have rubber guns. We have fake guns. Yeah. >> And specifically, sorry. Right before this incident, Hannah handed you the gun and said cold. It wasn't David. >> I don't recall. No. Hannah handed me the gun. >> Okay. It wasn't anybody else but Hannah. >> No. Hannah handed me the gun >> and she specifically said >> she I believe she said cold. I don't recall >> where. So this is my I'm not that great of a drawer, but this is the church. This is the front where the >> you enter here >> cross is where did she hand it the gun to you inside? >> Oh yes I was seated. In other words I was this is the scene in the church where you come in and there's a lot of disarray. There's benches tipped over and they're like and here was one bench that was upright and sturdy. Some of the other benches are prop benches so they can smash easily with with explosives. You want the gunfire to have uh um fake benches. They're made of a lighter wood. So if they put charges inside so when you shoot the cinematically when a guy is shooting a gun and you turn around to see what he's shooting at, you're going to see charges that are buried inside. They put a little material and you're going to see boom boom boom things flash. That is a prop bench. There were prop benches around that they were eventually going to put today were going to put squibs in to have them blow up. And this was a real bench, a heavy cuz if you sat on the prop bench, it would break. >> Mhm. >> This was a live bench and I sat here and the camera was here and she was here and Joel was here. >> She being Helena. >> Helena. >> Okay. And >> I'm here on the bench sitting. I'm right here to the right. come all all the way to one side. They wanted me to go all the way to that side. And the camera guy was here. He's behind. Hannah was here. Joel was here. Where the other people I believe that the prop the script was always in that corner so she could see the actual. And when I shot the gun away from the cameraman, I never aimed at the camera. I turned and I went like this just to aim the and she was there and the gun went off and she just went right on the ground. >> What about the armorer though? Or was she? >> She's outside. >> Okay. She hands me She hands me the gun all the time. >> And then what? >> If there's any shooting involved in the scene, she always hands me the gun. >> Never has Dave handed you the gun. >> Never. >> Okay. And then she goes back outside. >> She waits outside cuz she just can't be there. So don't want to see. Sometimes in scenes there's reflections like you know you you see. So she So you only need the necessary crew in there for shooting the camera. Everybody else leaves and as soon as they hit cut, they come running back. >> Okay. Real quick before she shows you that, the other thing I wanted to know, and it's probably helping she does show you those wrong. Um, have you in your experience ever been told that you're not supposed to [ __ ] the gun? >> No. >> No, you're you're okay. >> He wanted He wanted me to [ __ ] the gun to the scene. >> Okay. >> He wanted that as part of the scene. He said, "We have to take the gun out, turn, and [ __ ] it into the to the to the right, my left, to their right of the lens." In other words, if I'm sitting here and you're the camera, we don't talk about my left. We talk about camera right. Camera right. We only talk about the camera. Camera right is my left. So I'll say to you, "Where do you want me to aim the gun?" They'll say, "Came right." So I'll aim the gun to my left. >> Okay? >> So I always aim the gun away, but she was there. And in the rehearsal, he wanted me to pull out the gun and [ __ ] the gun. And if you're assuming you have a cold gun, there's no problem, >> right? And again, a cold gun I'd had every time we've used guns on this film the last two weeks, we never had one problem. Never. Never. >> Okay. And I don't Maybe you guys discussed this when I was going. Um, after the gun was shot, who did you hand the gun to? >> I don't remember. >> Okay. >> I don't remember. I made everybody freaked out. >> Yeah, I think so. Okay. >> It was one of those two paper halls over I don't really know. I would imagine. Well, there's the dummy there. So, that's probably a dummy round. And there's no drill in this. That might be a flash round. And as I said, >> so flash rounds do not have holes. >> Well, you the flash round has a charge in here of powder, different sizes. Like I said, quarter half full load and a wading in there to pack it in. It's packed in tightly. >> Okay. >> So when you hit this pin, it explodes. Now sometimes it has this material there if you have to have the cosmetic feature through the gun and then shoot. >> But often it has there's the BB's in there. This is a this is a dummy round. No dummy here, but there's that. My point is that very often when you give me when she's loaded the gun with rounds for us to go hot and flash and shoot, they've had that creased folded head, >> the dumpling head, as we say. >> Okay, >> they've almost never looked like this for the flash. Only when the camera sees inside the cylinder do you put those in there, >> but those are both dummy rounds. >> That's a dummy. >> That's a demi. >> That's what they taught me. Yeah, something I'm not an expert experience with. >> We'll find out though. I'm sure my I always said to my wife, I think I should get a gun. I'm getting a little nervous about the weather. My wife was like, "No, no, no, no, no, no. I got six kids. I'm 63 years old and I have an 8-year-old, a 6-year-old, a 5-year-old, a 3-year-old, a one-year-old, and an 8-month-old who we had as a surrogate. Oh my gosh. >> I'm 63 years old and we had se we had six kids in seven years. >> So my wife is always she was born in the US but raised in Spain. She's like I lack we will not be having any guns in the house. No no no. But >> okay >> private institute a dummy round. >> So you call this a flash round right? >> No flash round means there's a charge in there. No charge in there if you hear that sound. >> Okay. >> No charge in there if you see that. >> So what happened? shoot these >> or to what you >> you put them in there cosmetically with nothing in them so that through the cylinder you can see that >> okay >> you can see in the cylinder whether the cylinder is empty >> and they look bad continuity wise or that there's a round in there so they put a cosmetic round in the chamber they load the gun close it and then I hold the gun you see the things in there a flash round would be like a what crypt is the word a crypt round with a charge inside And that one shoots and there's no projectile. I'm really challenged whether they ever see I doubt sometimes they have these where you can do both, but that's the clay uh uh material. But usually 99% of the time we shot a flash round. It was the crimp thing and you don't see inside the cylinder. >> So you're the camera and I'm not pointing where you can see it. I'm off a little bit and all you see is the flash. Do you know what would happen if you shot one of these? Have you ever had experience with that? >> Nothing. >> Nothing happens with them >> with no charge in them. >> Okay. >> This is this this indicates >> bottoms, >> right? Well, sometimes they have the pin to create something. I'm just saying when I look at this, when I go like this now, by the way, there could be a charge in there and that charge and those BB's could come out. I don't know. I I don't know enough about it to know whether this rattling indicates that it's an empty a cold round. That's obviously a cold round cuz that's where the gunpowder would be in here. >> Mhm. >> That's a cold round. This I'm assuming is a cold round cuz they go like this to tell themselves it's a cold route. I believe, please don't take my word for it. I >> just in your experience, >> I'm a father of six children pretty much. That's all I do these days. My experience, those are both cold rounds. Okay. >> And I was told by halls that when they took the gun away and looked at them, every round inside the gun was a cold round except the one round. Was not only a hot round, it was a live round. It was a bullet. If you're telling me that that's what came out of his shoulder, there's something really, really scary going on here. Well, and I think that's what she was trying to ask is if if any time >> Well, you said these are cold ones, but the ones that are not cold, the quarter, >> right? >> Those they have the crimp t. >> Have you ever seen anything like that ever come out on set? >> No, it's not possible. >> Not possible. Okay. >> Yeah, they don't have a head. I'm saying they don't have a There's no projectile. >> There's no projectile. Okay. So then and you shouldn't >> Somebody put a live bullet in the gun. Okay. Cuz they shouldn't separate or do that either. >> No. >> Okay. >> Separate. It'll probably >> like that shouldn't come out either. When if it it does. >> If you did a flash round, that wouldn't be there. >> Okay. >> This is a cosmetic round only, >> right? >> I point the gun that's in the cylinder. When we shoot the gun, 99% of the time it's a flash round that you don't see in the cylinder. >> You're the camera and I'm slightly off. So, you don't see the gun. >> I'm sorry. We keep having you explain that, but it's just cuz there's different rounds, >> right? I'm saying this is a cosmetic round to my knowledge. And if there is, another question for you is, is there a cosmetic round that I mean, is there a flash round that has the head, which I believe they have where you can shoot into the gun? Meaning, if the director wants you to aim the gun at the camera and they put a looseite screen up there, and I shoot the gun at you, you can see the bullets inside there. Well, they can go do that with a computer. >> Mhm. But if I put the thing toward you and then shoot, they'll have a round that has this on there that'll explode. But again, I've been told that is a clay material or something that just dissolves on explosion. No projectile comes out on a flash round. On a flash round, it blows up that you shoot on camera. Quarter, half full. There is no projectile unless some material is stuck in the barrel of the gun. >> Okay. And I thought for sure what happened was did they not check there was a a stone or whatever. Now again I am speechless. We're here shooting. Everything was going fine. Joel is my friend. I'm one of the producers on this movie. We've developed this movie together for three years. I left my wife and six kids in New York to come here for a month to shoot this movie. And I'm the one that shot the gun today that had a live bullet go through that woman's body and into his body. And I need to know how did that happen? Where did that bullet come from? Where did a there's there are no live rounds at Hurricane I'm told. >> Everybody is sitting around waiting for me to come here with all the sheriffs and all the people the people that were there waiting for us to get ready to come and do this with you and they all they did was talk about that. the speculation of like in her kit. She doesn't have live rounds >> and and that's what we were told. That's what we asked her. She said it's there is no live rounds. Not even on her kit, not on set anywhere. So >> for that very reason, >> we want to know the same question too. Yeah. How if there's not supposed to be any live rounds on set, >> then it comes down to >> and who possible manufactured defect for them >> that a cosmetic round shot the this projectile through them. >> Is that possible? Did you find? I don't know. >> It's possible. >> Oh, it is. They told you the mechanically that's possible. >> Yes. So, sometimes there is a charge in the end of not intentionally, but >> a mistake. Today I sit here and whether it was a misfiring theatrical round or a live I shot this woman with a gun today. >> Yeah, it doesn't feel so good, you know. >> I I can imagine that would not feel good. >> I feel really bad. You know, it's like I don't I mean everything was going great. The only problem we had was when these six guys wanted to quit and there I don't know the the jargon but their uh uh you know uh union rep or whatever and the New Mexico contract different contracts of different states the person that was in charge of these people and a kind of a pipeline a lot of shooting going on a lot of movie TV work in Albuquerque Santa Fe the person where their head person told them don't strike it's not again we want we don't want to [ __ ] the indie business and put all of our employees out of work our indie contract is is is set for now. You have a contract you're under. Nobody can renegotiate that contract, which no doubt they will. Uh but in the meantime, you have a contract that you agreed to. And those men came, I'm not criticizing them, they came under a contract, which they knew what it was. They reported to work and then halfway through the the uh the uh shooting, they left. They they walked off. And I don't you know, when he said to me, "Well, my guys are sleeping in my car." the ads and the producers and I mean well they're they're uh you know they're they're all of a sudden complaining about a contract they've been working on it for quite a while and uh and some days we wrap and they have they shoot nights those are tough the men the women have to go back to their homes and they'd be Albuquerque and drive an hour and it's 3:00 in the morning you know >> and we try to put the night shooting on the weekend so when you wake up following you're off >> and then the uh um And then some days we wrapped very the day before they walked off the job. We wrapped at 5:45 in the afternoon. A very reasonable day. Had a very easy day. Say it was 6:00 cuz I'm driving away with them and I waved to that guy. The guy says, "I want to talk to you, the heavy set guy." And I'm leaving. I said, "I'll see you tomorrow." And I left cuz I want to get I want to get home, >> right? >> I want to go call my kids before they go to bed in New York. And uh the um uh yesterday when I was driving and I saw him, the sun was still out. We didn't shoot a day like usually we shoot till we lose the light. >> Mhm. >> That's why we're here to shoot New Mexico. >> Yeah. >> New Mexico is the star of the movie. >> Scenery. >> Yeah. >> Okay. So, do you in your opinion feel that this could have been an accident or do you >> I want to believe that. Let me ask you this cuz I don't know anything about this cuz it was it was such mayhem when this happened. Everybody was sick that this happened cuz we didn't know. No, no one imagined. Everyone thought she was hit by wading or got burned. >> No one presumed she was shot with a bul that any projectile went through her body. No one even considered that that wasn't possible. So the question is the cartridge that came out the cartridge of when the gun that they have you got that >> so we have to send that we don't analyze that stuff we collect it but then we send it to lab >> it was collected you have >> it will be >> right that's that's all I'm saying is that to I'm like I'm wondering what was that what was in that they're measure I don't know anything about that what are they what ballistics how can they measure what was in that >> m >> how much of it >> and that's that'll all be done at the Yeah. I I don't know. All I knew was the gun went off. She hit the floor. He hit the floor. He started screaming. He's in a lot of pain. She went into shock. >> She went into She didn't talk, >> right? >> Her eyes are rolling back in her head and blah blah blah and uh bad. And everybody starts getting really and then they start doing CPR putting and everybody gets really panicky and then people start wondering, you know, what did something we assumed because the watting can burn you. There's material that can come out under vats very rarely that could burn you. But remember that often doesn't happen because there's always a cold gun on the rehearsal. >> By the time you leave, if the wading comes out of it, hit somebody, they're 20 ft away from you in a gunfight. The crew is away. You're not shooting anybody. They're the crew. And my point is that when this and when she went down, I thought, what was stuck? We all said the same thing. What was stuck in the barrel? Was something left? They didn't clean the barrel, which we they always do. Always. And was there a rock or something that went that went through her body? I didn't know about the passing through her body. I know she was hit. I didn't know where and I don't know what to what extent, but we all presumed as we're sitting outside bullshitting for the last 2 hours while this went on. The aftermath, we assumed something was launched in the barrel was a projectile that went into her body. Now, when you tell me that's what came out of Joel's shoulder, that's a faulty round, which I've never heard of that before. >> Okay. >> Never. I've never heard of a of a theatrical flash round that was loaded into a gun that had a projectile that misfired and that projectile came out that was it was a lethal round. Normally, if you're going to have a round that has this on it, it's the material that disintegrates when you fire the gun. >> Cuz if you take a flash round with a gunpowder in it, whether it's a quarter, half, or full load, and you put a real bullet on, that's called a bullet. That's not a movie bullet. That's a bullet. >> Bullet. Yeah. >> How did that happen? I mean, I'm dying to I'm the person that fired the gun. I'm dying to find out how that happened. How did that bullet that caused it end up in her kit? >> And and again, we're not going to know if it was manufacturer issues or someone did bring a live round until it's been tested and we looked at the whole uh casing and projectile of it. So, is there anybody on set that you would think would want want to uh cause a disturbance in the filming or have any issues with anybody on set minus what happened if you don't think >> in the movie business there are always some whiny people. >> Okay. >> But not so much so that they want to shoot somebody. >> So nothing >> I've never heard of anything like this in my lifetime ever. I've made 75 movies. >> So in the past couple of weeks that you've been on set, there's nobody really No one I would imagine would be capable of doing something like this. >> Nothing that out of the ordinary. >> But again, I think it's a critical point to me, which is if this is a flash round, if there's a flash round and you have a piece here, this piece has to be a certain type. In other words, if you want, as I told you before, if you want the shot to go off and see that the cylinder cosmetically has a has a round in there. This is not of the thing that was in Joel's shoulder. >> But I and then I want to come back to this. You said that when the gun went off, you experienced no kick. >> Yeah, there was no recoil. >> There was no recoil. But that did I remember? >> Okay. >> I mean, literally, I'm holding the gun and and literally slowly slowly pull turn cop as soon as I copy. But bang and I jump. I mean, you obviously that's the last thing you think is going to happen. >> Mhm. >> Everything has been done. Every breath we take is to is to is to obiate that possibility. And the gun went off and uh all I can think of as I as I keep saying is that I've never heard of a flash round that had a bullet on top that had a projectile similar to what came out of Joel Schult. I've never heard of that in my life. Ever. Never. Never. Never. Never flash rounds. Never. Flash rounds normally have the crimping. If there's a head on there, it's made of a special material. And in this scene, you were to look down the barrel of the gun and shoot. Um, you have to ask them that, by the way. You have to ask, uh, well, both of them are in the hospital now. But was it their intention? Cuz, cuz when I give the gun, I'm assuming it's a cold gun with nothing in it. When it goes to time to shoot, are they going to see in the barrel that there's a gun there? Very often what they'll do is they'll have you put the cosmetic round and I'll draw the gun up. I'll aim it. They cut and cinematically they'll cut to the other guy going like this. Then they'll cut back to me with the flash round with no projectile. But all I'm saying to you is a theatrical round, a flash round with a bullet head. I've never heard of that in my life. Ever. Never. Never. Never. Cuz that's a bullet. Less of a charge, but that's a bullet. I don't know what to say. I've never heard of this in my life. >> What's your date of birth? >> April 3rd, 1958. >> Do we have um Is there someone that we can contact if we have other questions for you? >> My assistant's name is Jonah. >> Jonah J. >> J O N A H. His last name is Foxman. They told me that you wanted this correct. J O N J O N A H Foxman F Ox M A N [Music] We have one more here. Okay. Okay. >> Uh >> what are we going to do? >> Uh you can go wherever. >> Well, let me ask you this. >> Originally, this is a very complicated I mean honest compared to what happened to them, but my wife and my whole family was Mhm. >> And on Saturday, my daughter was going to be in the movie >> at a little park for my daughter. >> The 8-year-old, she was so excited to go. >> And now the question is Joel's not going to go back to work for a while, >> right? >> I doubt he'll be back to work in a week or two at that. Who knows what they're going to do, but they're going to get the [ __ ] suit out of him. >> He I mean, I think his was a shoulder. He might, you know, I don't know. It's up to him how he feels and stuff on on >> but I'm I'm sure that there are so many insurance issues for them. They may hear halts on >> they're in a lot of trouble insurance wise and and and civil action wise. All I'm saying is this. I told them I would stay here tomorrow. My family's not going to come now. >> They're going to I begged them to come in. My wife wants to cancel the trip. She says she thinks it's just a weird energy. I told the producers that I would stay tomorrow in case anybody else, their insurance investigators, anybody, their lawyers wanted to talk to me. I'll make myself and then Saturday I was going to fly home to New York and just wait for them to tell me what to do. Did you need me to stay here beyond Saturday? I I will do whatever you tell me to do. >> Okay. So, I think so what what we need to do, we're going to go and process the scene. if there's any else that comes up um and that we need to contact you. You said you'll be here till Saturday. >> Oh, no. As of now, I'm going to stay tomorrow to make myself available to the insurance investigators and their return that productions attorneys >> to make myself available. They've told me they're not sure they need to talk to me. I'm going to stay tomorrow and get on a plane Saturday to go home and god knows when we're going to come back. It might be months. >> Okay. I can contact you. As long as we have this number, he's not going to change it. >> The number what I'm trying to say is that I'm going to leave on Saturday unless you tell me not to. >> You're okay. >> If you tell me to come back in, I'm going to do whatever you tell me to do. But but my wife wanted me to come home. >> Yes. Yeah. So, as long as we have a way of contacting you is is what we need to do >> to get a hold of you. Okay. But I think you going unless tomorrow you hear something different from us cuz right now we're going to go. We'll interview tomorrow. I'll come here right away. >> Okay. Yes. >> Tell me what you want. >> What's your work though? >> Um I know >> or your office. Sorry. >> That one I uh don't know. I don't >> So 2850 49 2850. This is works out. I'll just >> So, the two of you are now best friends and you go bowling together and go to the movies together now. >> Yeah. [Music] >> Uh my So, this is my card. Uh that's I put her name on the back of that one. But my um office is office. >> Oh, let me put my cuz mine's a different size. Yeah, I don't um my desk phone has issues so I use my work cell phone all the time and that's usually the best way to get a settlement. Sure. And then if I'm not at my desk either >> if I don't hear from you otherwise I mean I'll come in tomorrow if you prefer but if I don't hear from you otherwise as of now I intend to go home on Saturday. >> So yeah and and that's fine because right now we still have other interviews to do. we got to go to the scene, process it. The the processing at the lab might take longer. So, you might even not hear from if you're backlogged right now. >> So, our investigation remotely >> if it comes to it, we will figure it out at that point. But right now, my wife wants to come. >> As of right now, you better listen to your wife and go home. >> Don't go there. >> Okay. Are we ready for uh I do have some very unfortunate news to tell you. >> What? >> Um she didn't make it. >> Yeah. So Joel's still at the hospital, but the other person involved didn't make it. Sorry, I just didn't want you to hear it outside of here. Is there something we could do for you? Um, What? Jonah the one up there. Um, yeah. >> Okay. Would you want Jonah in here with you? >> You want to What do you want to do? Do you want to make a call? You can sit. We should go. Are you guys needing a ride or are you comfortable? I think it's up there. Maybe it's Are you comfortable driving though? >> I want to go call my wife. >> Of course. We could even give you a go. >> Okay. We're going to go. >> No, that's fine. >> Can I get you more water or anything? Okay. Do you want to save you guys a few minutes in here? >> I want to go. In the aftermath of the tragic shooting on October 21st, 2021, criminal charges were brought against several individuals involved in the Rust production. First, Assistant Director David Halls pleaded no contest to a misdemeanor count of negligent use of a deadly weapon. He received 6 months of unsupervised probation, a $500 fine, and 24 hours of community service, a reflection of the court's view of his role in handing over the firearm without confirming its status. The armorer, Hannah Gutierrez Reed, faced far more serious consequences. In March 2024, she was convicted of involuntary manslaughter for introducing live ammunition onto the set and failing to follow basic safety protocols. She received the maximum sentence of 18 months in prison. Gutierrez Reed was acquitted of tampering with evidence and began serving her term in April. She was released on parole in May 2025 subject to strict conditions including no contact with the Hutchkins family electronic monitoring and mental health assessment. Alec Baldwin, initially charged with involuntary manslaughter in both January and July of 2024, saw his case dismissed with prejudice in July, meaning it cannot be reinstated. The judge ruled that prosecutors mishandled and withheld critical evidence, violating Baldwin's right to a fair trial. A subsequent appeal by the prosecution to reinstate the charges failed in early 2025, firmly ending Baldwin's legal jeopardy. By mid 2025, with the criminal cases concluded, several civil suits were settled. The Rust producers, including Baldwin, reached undisclosed agreements with traumatized crew members. Meanwhile, cinematographer Helina Hutchkins family secured settlements as well, some of which included personal endorsements of the film's eventual release, hoping her artistic passion and legacy would be honored. In some what began as a tragic accident led to significant legal actions. Probation for Halls, prison time and parole for Gutierrez Reed, and full exoneration for Baldwin. While the criminal chapter has closed, the aftermath has sparked widespread debate about onset safety, responsible gun handling, and industry accountability. The Rust incident will stand as a pivotal moment in reforming film safety standards and a reminder of the human toll behind the headlines. What are your thoughts on the outcome of this incident? We invite you to share your perspective in the comments below. If you like our videos, please consider liking and subscribing to the channel. Subscribing is completely free, but it helps us tremendously by signaling to YouTube to share our content with more true crime enthusiasts like you. Your support allows us to continue creating and sharing real, compelling stories from the world of true crime. Thank you for watching and we'll see you at the next video.